The second semifinal at EURO 2024, between Netherlands and England, referee assignment.
Game 50, Semifinals
Dortmund, 10 July 2024 21:00 CET
Dortmund, 10 July 2024 21:00 CET
NETHERLANDS - ENGLAND
Referee: Felix Zwayer GER
Assistant Referee 1: Stefan Lupp GER
Assistant Referee 1: Stefan Lupp GER
Assistant Referee 2: Marco Achmüller GER
Fourth Official: Daniel Siebert GER
Reserve Assistant Referee: Rafael Foltyn GER
Fourth Official: Daniel Siebert GER
Reserve Assistant Referee: Rafael Foltyn GER
Video Assistant Referee: Bastian Dankert GER
Assistant Video Assistant Referee 1: Christian Dingert GER
Assistant Video Assistant Referee 2: Marco Fritz GER
Assistant Video Assistant Referee 2: Marco Fritz GER
UEFA Referee Observer: Roberto Rosetti ITA
UEFA Delegate: Peter Lundström FIN
REFEREES APPOINTED FOR THE COPA AMERICA SEMIFINALS:
ReplyDeleteArgentina vs. Canada
REF: Piero Maza (CHI)
A1: Claudio Urrutia (CHI)
A2: Jose Retamal (CHI)
4th: Cristian Garay (CHI)
Reserve Assistant: Juan Serrano (CHI)
VAR: Juan Lara (CHI)
AVAR: Edson Cisternas (CHI)
Uruguay vs. Colombia
REF: Cesar Ramos (MEX)
Á1: Alberto Morin (MEX)
Á2: Marco Bisguerra (MEX)
4th: Mario Escobar (GUA)
Reserve Assistant: Humberto Panjoj (GUA)
VAR: Carlos Orbe (ECU)
AVAR: Christian Lescano (ECU)
I guess Sampaio or Elfath will referee the final
Wow. Felix Zwayer with Siebert as FO.
ReplyDeleteFelix Zwayer is a referee !!!
ReplyDeleteconfirmed by Uefa.com
ReplyDeleteReferees
Felix Zwayer GER
Referee
Stefan Lupp GER
Assistant referees
Marco Achmüller GER
Bastian Dankert GER
Video Assistant Referee
Christian Dingert GER
Assistant Video Assistant Referee 1
Marco Fritz GER
Assistant Video Assistant Referee 2
Daniel Siebert GER
Fourth official
Wow! This makes the things even crazier. The management is awful,complete disaster. I guess Zwayer is a pretty known face within the Dutch team now, 3 games in a row.
DeleteWhy am I surprised still - I mentioned yesterday how political the appointing is.
DeleteThis appointment is the cherry on the cake!
+1
DeleteWow, so what to expect now,CHEFREN? Both of us predict Marciniak. What now?
ReplyDeleteAnd now to complete the confusion let's remember what Rosetti said: Some referee will get 4 games each.....Orsato already did them.
ReplyDeleteEaxctly: "Some refereeing teams did one match, some two; others will do three and, maybe some, four." So the four was maximum. I can't wait to see if he blatantly lied to everyone. Orsato totally deserve the final but he should not have been appointed to other 2 KO stage games before.
DeleteRosetti said this statement after releasing R16 appointments. I suppose that he didn't planned appoint again Orsato to QF, specially 3 days after his 120min game, something went wrong.
DeleteSurely Marciniak for the final!
ReplyDeleteAs written above, Rosetti clearly has stated that refereeing teams will do 4 matches maximum. Also, what is the point of not sending Marciniak home if his last match was on 29.06?
The only logical explanation is that Marciniak was being saved for the final. Any other management is completely absurd.
Nobody will gave Marciniak the final, some reasons; He will be the only who will have CL,WC,EURO final, and in officiating world there are some unwritten rules about that. Of course,it would not be undeserved. Also, I saw that Orsato is clear for the final, only thing is that who will be 4th official, Turpin/Marciniak now.
ReplyDeleteSo in the other word, the best referees will get World Cup final, and the 2nd one will get the Euro final...
DeleteI find Zwayer's appointment quite deserved. The arguments against him (Bellingham & a German being angry about England after Taylor's performance) were ridiculous but I also expected committee to be extremely careful and avoid this appointment.
ReplyDeleteMore interesting: Maybe we all underestimated committee's disappointment with Marciniak's CL mistake, otherwise I can't explain his treatment in this EURO so far. Or he gets the Final but I don't really believe that right now. Orsato seems to be the one for Berlin next week - the final match in his career that committee prepared since weeks or months.
Hm, another surprise. A big questions now: What is with Marciniak?
ReplyDeleteChances for final:
Orsato 60%, Marciniak 30%, Turpin 10%.
Orsato with Marciniak as 4O?
Surely Turpin is out with France in the semis.
DeleteNow to focus on Zwayer appoitment. Quite deserved. Without any problems or controveries in the games. So, pretty satisfied whit this appoitment.
ReplyDeleteZwayers first 30 minutes in Turkey-Portugal were quite horrible but he got saved by the course of the game after Turkeys early own goal.
DeleteRomania-Netherlands was the easiest Ro16 match on paper and even there he had a major mistake, stopping Romanias counter-attack to a possible late equalizer, falling for a blatant Dumfries dive.
Maybe no controversies is true because his games delivered clear scorelines. But no problems? Do people even watch the games?
@ Kaer. Thing with Dumfries was a mistake for sure. But he didn't fall for "blatant Dumfries dive". He did see dangerous play without contact and awarded IFK for that. Immediately, not seeing on Dumfries. But Romanian player didn't play the ball with high foot. Simply perception error, nothing more. I don't want to say if this his nomination is good or bad. Only be objective please. Not only you, all of us.
DeleteI did see TUR - POR and ROM - NED and his performances were OK in my eyes.
Is soares dias officially sent home or could he be a surprise (but in case well deserved) name for the final?
ReplyDeleteSo if GER had beaten ESP, the SF2 would have been for Marciniak, right? Hard to see anybody else in that case.
ReplyDeleteMaybe in this case.... iff they don't want Marciniak
DeleteFrance-Spain Soares Dias
England-Netherlands Vincic
Soares Dias went home after his best game in the round of 16.
DeleteHappy for Zwayer of course, but all of this is absolutely insane.
ReplyDeleteOf course committee can do what they want, but please don't go for interviews about meritocracy. This is absolute bullshit.
Vincic straight to SF after Spa - Ita is a disgrace. He deserved KO stages, no problem, but straight to SF... come on.
However, appointing referees directly for a semi-final match after the group stage is also a common practice at World Cups:
Delete2022: RAMOS
2018: CAKIR and CUNHA
2014: CAKIR and RODRIGUEZ
2006: LARRIONDA
2002: MEIER and NIELSEN
...
Ramos has R16 match: Portugal-Switzerland.
DeleteOrsato was directly to SF.
I can add Eriksson on 2016, at Euro.
Ramos got PORSUI (R16) at WC2022 (he was a second choice for FRAMAR because Elfath couldn't referee Morocco) . It's Orsato who went straight to SF.
DeleteOh, sorry, I should have used WIKIPEDIA (or another source) instead of my brain. ;-)
DeleteAgree - but Orsato and others deserved it by very good performances (especially Cakir at earlier WCs if I remember well). Vincic had a terrible Spa - Ita.
DeleteRosetti managed to annoy everyone but Čeferin and host country. What a surprise... He made scandalous choices at both EUROs he was the head of referees at. Meritocracy? Good joke! Such a puppet...
ReplyDeleteAlready getting my popcorn out for the Bellingham post match interview. Hopefully the English yellow press will finally pick up on Zwayers history since German media is neglecting that topic for years now.
ReplyDelete
DeleteNot only is Jude Bellingham taking part in this encounter, but it will also take place in Dortmund. I suspect, Manuel Gräfe will regard this appointment only as the second best option. ;-)
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DeleteIt isn’t pleasant to read such vitriol towards a referee on this forum, regardless of the specific story we all know (and if I understand the facts correctly, you are right, it should obviously have been game over for Zwayer back then). That being said, Kaer is correct when giving a resume of Zwayer’s tournament. ItaAlb was good, but the next two games were more at a 6-level and not necessarily that impressive, all whilst working on ‘normal difficulty matches’ (the Turkey match was rather inflamed by Zwayer than the contrary). In many ways this is a terrible, and so so avoidable, appointment by UEFA. I wish Zwayer the very best of luck in the match.
DeleteExactly. In my books, talking about Zwayer performances is obsolete because he forfeited the legitimacy being a referee due to being involved in the Hoyzer fraud.
DeleteBut even if we would talk about his performances, it was a solid Italy game and two (at best) mediocre games afterwards. Impossible to justify this appointment while sending e.g. Soares Dias home after a refereeing masterclass in a hot Turkey-Austria clash.
One thing is for sure, appointing Zwayer to this match shows that the RefComm actually has courage and isn’t necessarily easily dissuaded by public pressure. They could have so easily switched the two semifinal referees. Putting Zwayer on this game is truly a “we don’t give a f*** about what the media has to say” move and I respect that.
DeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteOh oh Rosetti what a mess you have made of this Euro
ReplyDeleteAbsolutely incredible appointment. I think that the situation Marciniak - committee at moment is very problematic. There aren't other explanations, impossible to think that Marciniak will be in final, he is not liked anymore by Rosetti after the CL semifinal, I'm sure.
ReplyDeleteAnd about the statement "some referees will get 4 but no more than that", indeed now committee will show that they work with appointments has been absolutely poor. Because there aren't other names if not Orsato, so why appointing him for the quarterfinals as well?
NO point in trying to understand this - appointments in the KO rounds have been baffling to say the least and some make absolutely no sense at all!!
DeleteRosetti is a referee observer
ReplyDeleteIt is an fabulous comedy this committee. Rosetti himself is a parody.
ReplyDeleteLet's be serious, we don't look at his past, but look at Zwayer now, what he did in ROU - NED, an easy game, he made it so bad.
Kovacs, who personally I hate for a big mistake against the team I support, was sent home because he applied the instructions that Rosetti gave him and he made no crucial mistakes.
Makkelie, who is one of the best manager, was sent home because Rosetti doesn't like him.
Vincic, who is so hard to watch!!! was given a SF...
Good Job UEFA Ref Committee!
What exactly did Zwayer "so bad" in ROU-NED? Kovacs no crucial mistake in CZE-TUR? Missing red card is no crucial mistake?
DeleteAnd some of us thought Zwayer couldn’t be a referee with England, and not even as 4O. :)
ReplyDeleteThe remaining question is: why are Turpin and Letexier both kept in Germany? I can see Turpin as 4O to Orsato if France is out. But why would they keep Letexier… Is there still a chance to see a full French crew in the final?
No Orsato in the final? England vs Switzerland as last match of his career doesn’t make sense.
I think this should be the first appointment with full members from same country? Unless I missed something before.
ReplyDeleteWell, in addition to other motivations, one can read this choice also as a gift for the host... after their national team got eliminated by Spain.
And the appointment confirms us 100% that Zwayer is clearly seen ahead of Siebert. Despite of the latter having attended two major tournaments, while this was the first one for the former. I had thought about him even as possible candidate for the final, before the kick off of first game, but of course in totally different situation and one could never guess the crazy management by committee during the EURO.
DeleteSiebert for a clean name for this game, so this even more allow us to think he was called only to be second German there...
I have nothing against Zwayer here. Someone said earlier, the two SF appointments have been the most political I have ever seen. It's incredible just how blatant this is!!
DeleteThe older ones might remember, that in WC78 the refereeing committee was comprised of an Italian as head of, and members from Uruguay and Austria. The Final was handled by (surprise, surprise) an Italian with linesmen (as they were called then) from the two other countries mentioned above. There were many other examples in the past, and many on this site complained about the blatant politisation not long ago, in EURO20(21).
DeleteIt's simpler than that. UEFA have to do something to assuage the Germans' anger about Taylor. In doing so, Zwayer is in a very ambiguous situation.
ReplyDeleteOf course a political choice, as always... but what if Zwayer appointment was somehow a test for SuperCup final in August? UEFA have to develop some new referee for future UCL / EL / UECL finals, and it seems a good starting point for the top German referee.
ReplyDeleteI thought Nyberg or Eskas would be sensible choice, but they will be both in Olympics. Kruzliak after a good CL path (and a shadow EURO) could be rewarded with this game as well.
An EURO SF certainly is not the place for a "test", especially not for a much less important Supercup game.
DeleteI think Siebert was very unlucky in His two Games.
ReplyDeleteThere were morecdifficult scenes in two Games, than in Zwayer s three Games.
For me , Siebert is still number one.Zwayers past is too stressful.
And the biggest problem of German refereeing is that mr. Siebert is no 1
DeleteYes, he was unlucky with OFRs. But otherwise his performance in GEO - CZE was less than satisfactory. Weak disciplinary control, mistakes in foul detection. Everything against CZE (this was unlucky). Before Euro he was No 2 in Germany according to last international season and he only confirmed this position.
DeleteAnd now we have the best referee of the tournament imo (Soares Dias) already home. Great management...
ReplyDeleteIf France is eliminated, I have the impression that Turpin has a chance?
ReplyDeleteYes, as a fourth official. At the end,every Orsato pefromance was slgihtly better than his.
DeleteI’m starting to think, Turpin does have a chance.
DeleteTwo arguments:
- Turpin and Letexier are both still in Germany. Why would you keep Letexier around?
- There have been too many Italian referees in WC/EURO finals. Collina, Rosetti, Rizzoli. But zero French. This is not balanced at all.
Spain vs England/Netherlands - CR: Turpin (4O: Letexier)?
Turpin kept because Rosetti had clearly big plans for Turpin, then he had to renounce due to the very poor performance in first game and the French national team still there. I think it's simply impossible to see Turpin with final, would be a very embarrassing choice for committe, after that they should only resign. After having sent home referees for nothing and talking about the best referees for best games. But having to make a choice at this tournament between Orsato and Turpin, well, the answer should be easy. And it must be clear that I'm writing that not to be in favor of Orsato, I started to write that the day after Germany - Scotland.
DeleteLetexier was kept in my opinion with a chance to give him maybe even a semifinal according to performances shown, but in his case France has been a problem.
I think one can only expect one of them as fourth referee in the final if France out, but nothing more.
@Chefren:
DeleteIt was announced AFTER Turpin’s QF (when France already advanced to the semi) that both Turpin and Letexier are retained in Frankfurt.
How do you explain that both French officials are retained regardless of their national team in the semi? I guess, they still have a shot when France is out…
Of course Rosetti needs more referees staying in Germany, in case of unexpected factors (injuries for example), but not all the referees who are staying can get more appointments. Cakir on last EURO stays till the end and I think Marciniak on this EURO will be the same case.
DeleteAnd Pairetto SR. in EURO96.
DeleteRosetti has really become an embarrassment.I'm really curious, do you think that Zwayer has performed enough in the tournament to be appointments for the semifinals? Uefa is really a disgraceful institution. In the past Cakir, Lahoz, Hategan and now Makkiele and Marciniak are subjected to ridiculous policies and mobbing by Rosetti. How long will this disgrace continue? Some referees are penalized for the smallest mistakes while others are rewarded despite making big mistakes.
ReplyDeleteThe last lines are the best during the whole tournament!!
DeleteWhat if I argued that Orsato has 0% chance on Sunday?
ReplyDeleteThen I would counter that his chances are higher than those of a USA referee.
DeleteBut, to answer more seriously: Many of us have noticed that Daniele Orsato's fitness is not the best. If UEFA intended him for the final, they could indeed have used him less excessively in the knockout phase.
DeleteAlways expect the unexpected
DeleteBut what if my chances and Orsato's chances are the same?
DeleteYou have to be in Germany to have a chance to referee the final, right?
You see - @usaref (see yesterday's post and response) IMO is a guy in the know :-)
DeleteReading between the lines, I'm not sure if Marciniak has the political backing for the final - However, the way he has been managed may indicate 1 final appearance.
Otherwise, with the words of a "big surprise", can mean someone we didn't think stands a chance like a Turpin/Letexier.
I'm starting to think that the Italian may not get the final after all- The appointment to the Ro16 and QF (Along with Oliver who is reportedly home) suggests that was his lot and if it's true the Rosetti states 4 matches then Orsato won't get the final.
Well I'm not surprised anymore let's be honest!
Hahah @ usaref - very interesting if he's home already!!
DeleteCrikey, let's be honest then, if the French are retained along with Marciniak who hasn't been used in the SF line-up and we are saying Oliver/Orsato are home. Can only mean 1 thing right?
At this point I would have opened a discussion with the prediction for the final referee, but honestly I lost the passion after all what we saw!
ReplyDeleteChefren, I can agree with many of your arguments, but if you say that Marciniak cannot get to this final, you are wrong. :)
DeleteInterestingly, given UEFA's current lineup policy (Orsato with a Switzerland game immediately Italy was eliminated by them), it would also have been an option to select either Makkelie or Oliver for the final, depending on whose national team will be eliminated in the semifinals. In my opinion, both would have been eligible (Oliver, among other things, with a quarter-final appearance at both the last World Cup and the last European Championships in his palmares) - but, as we know, one of them is already back home ...
Delete+after
Deleteof course Peter, Oliver is also an option
DeleteOrsato made a bit of a mess in the group match against Germany, ok, but he was still a candidate for the final appearance. However, the quarter-final match after 1/8 should reveal a lot to you...
DeleteI'm glad there was no prediction game this time for exactly that reason.
DeleteI would add that Marciniak's management was specifically for the last match, yes, I know, there will be laughter soon :)
ReplyDeletemeritocracy? come on rosetti, shame on you!
ReplyDeleteAnd now we have a list of possible referees for the final ...
ReplyDelete1. Orsato, very good referee but his fitnes is not as good as for a final ... and he alrady has 4 matches.
2. Oliver, has 2 great matches but England is still there ... and UEFA doesnt like him so much.
3. Turpin, very good referee, great abbility to addapt to the mach but France is still there ... and he was never a favorite until the TUR-NET match.
4. Marciniak, very good referee, great personality, but UEFA has menaged him as un anwanted referee (from the beghining).
My oppinion is for Turpin (no FRA in the final) or Orsato (if FRA in the final)
From IG Dan Cook, Team Oliver already back home.
Deletedoes not like? This is the most trusted and experienced referee for the committee. And most importantly... he's in shape. :)
DeleteUEFA wants fair play and the referees are there to help the players with playing fair. Unfortunatly the referees themselves can't count on fair play from the ref com and UEFA.
ReplyDeleteThe way several referees are treated this Euro is so very difficult to understand.
How difficult is it to appoint the twelve best referees from group stage for the 1/8 and 1/4 finals (and in this selection experience is taken into account next to current form)? And after that to choose out of those twelve, the three refs for the SF en F?
And of course ref com can take into account that one of the referees has an outstanding palmares and this is his last tournament.
But you can't send refs home for a thing with extra time, while others can stay after blatant missed penalties, while others are send home after a missed penalty. And you can't judge a referee in a challanging match the same as a referee in a very easy match with not much media attention.
It just isn't fair. And it's very bad HR management, wich can have concesquences for the form of certain referees in the next season.
You have to keep a number of referees as "window dressing" to mask the final referee; as it was with Mazic and Clattenburg/Kassai in 2016, otherwise everyone works out who has been selected
ReplyDeleteI honestly cannot understand why you would appoint Zwayer to such an exposed game. You are literally setting him up for failure, no?
ReplyDelete1. There is the whole Hoyzer Scandal, in which he was involved. This wasn't scrutinized on an international stage, at least not as far as I am aware. After this game people will scream bloody murder if there is even the slightest bit of controversy.
2. He hasn't refereed one single game of Dortmund ever since the incident with Bellingham (who hasn't been with Dortmund for one season now). And no Real Madrid game either, so he's been kept away from Bellingham and the two haven't spoken about the incident as far as it is publicly know. Why would you add fire to a game that just from a pure sports perspective is already going to be a challenge with two teams who are able to reach the Final.
Let's just say Minute 10 you need to give a RC to Bellingham, will he have the guts to do it? Will he think twice about it, because it is Bellingham? What if he doesn't give it?
3. Purely performance based, he did good but not great, so why give him a SF above others, is it because he's German and the tournament is played here?
From a German perspective, while I like to see my countryman succeed, it just feels wrong to have someone with so much controversy appointed and representing us on this level.
+1
DeleteI fully agree with you and also with what Kaer wrote above. In my eyes Zwayer does not deserve to be a referee at this level.
DeleteHe does a decent job, don't get me wrong. The semi final is somewhat deserved as to the fact that contrary to Turpin or Orsato he did not have that one bad game or huge mistake so far.
As a German referee I'm between a rock and a hard place here. Of course, I'm proud that my country is represented in the semi finals for the second consecutive Euro. On the other side, I'm still getting called a "Hoyzer Referee" when I'm making mistakes (or something that is perceived as such) in my games...
Very bold tip finale Siebert
ReplyDeleteTo be honest, I can't imagine Rosetti staying for the 2024/25 season and being taken seriously by referees
ReplyDeleteEURO20:
- Çakır confirmed for London 'final four' after phenomenal performance in R16 and then rejected for no reason
- Brych appointed to QF and SF after terribly losing control in BELPOR R16
- Kuipers shielded towards the final with three easy games
2021/22 season
- recklessly giving very promising Siebert everything what ended up in a nightmare in UCL QF
- no support to Makkelie after he was attacked by Al-Khelaifi and Leonardo after PSG - Real Madrid in R16
- appointing Turpin instead of Makkelie to the UCL Final that season
- political promotion of Hernández Hernández in 2023
EURO24:
- political nomination for Marco Guida instead of Irfan Peljto
- conflict with Marciniak before the tournament and mistreatment of the Polish team during the tournament
- rejecting Gil Manzano and Makkelie after group stage without a real reason
- sending Soares Dias home after the best performance of the tournament in AUTTUR R16
- keeping both eyes closed to Vinčić' lack of HUGE advantage in HUNSUI and lost control in ESPITA and undeservedly appointing him directly to SF ESPFRA
- ignoring wrongly broken up HUGE chance of Romania in ROUNED R16 and appointing the German to ENGNED SF (vs treatment of Soares Dias)
- unexpectedly sending home the main favourite for the final, Orsato after surprisingly giving him exhausting R16 and QF being aware of his fitness issues
[still to see who is appointed to the final but I think it's already more than enough]
That’s a very long list indeed. @ESF
ReplyDeleteHorrible management by the RefCom. The referees can only pray for better times.
Now, in case of a NED loss, they just have to bring back Makkelie for a fun and surprising twist…
After continuous lack of support, missed UCL finals, sacrificial (challenging) appointments without any finals. And finally, a controversial rejection at EURO 2024.
It is confirmed that Orsato is now in home? @Euro Soccer Ref (Your sources are always right).
ReplyDeleteHuge surprise!
Orsato is still in Germany,waiting for the final nomination. No officials sources that he is at home. And,it will be stupid to send him home after two top performances in knock out stages.
ReplyDeleteAs usaref mentioned earlier, Orsato is home
ReplyDeleteCrikey, let's be honest then, if the French are retained along with Marciniak who haven't been used in the SF 's - not sure who else is left that hasn't been used or reportedly home.
Can only mean 1 thing right?
I have a question for all of you,especially for usaref and alfie46, who will be in the final if there are France-England?
ReplyDeleteLogic says Marciniak
Delete+1 - As I said not sure who else is around but Kruzliak or Siebert could act as 4th (not ideal)
DeleteNo way. After semifinal in CL,and what Rosseti said to him. Of course, his final would not be undeserved, but, nobody will give him the final, becouse no one have three grand finals CL,EC,WC, from UEFA in history. Have you got any other option?
DeleteAs I said, I don't know who else has been retained. I've heard today that Orsato has been sent home from what it seems a reliable source and I have seen with my own eyes that Dan Cook has gone home (doesn't necessarily mean that Oliver has gone though)
DeleteOliver is home. Orsato is home.
DeleteI think the three referees remaining who are not on the SFs are Marciniak, Turpin and Taylor. It seems quite obvious, at this moment, that the smart money is on Marciniak. Spain would need to win for Turpin to have a shot.
I don't see how Taylor would ever be used. He can't work England. If it's Spain-Netherlands, you would think Turpin gets that. And the chances of Taylor getting the Netherlands-France rematch...? Got to be zero, right?
So soares dias not there any more?
DeleteNo, he is not.
DeleteChefren,do you have any info about ORSTAO, or all of this are unnoficial.
ReplyDeleteCan't say it's official, because you know, there aren't public releases on such topic, but it is indeed reported by several sources, even in Italy.
Deletewhich sources? can you name some?
DeleteORSATO FOR FINAL:
ReplyDelete+ outstanding and long-time career
+ last match in his career
+ extending career for euro
+ appreciation by Rosetti (surprisingly that Rosetti nomineed Orsato for UCL final 2020)
+ nationality
+ good tournament
+ huge nathural charisma
+ only one grand final in his palmares
- his fitness
- four matches
- missing penalty to Germany and Cererin might have a doubts about penalty against his Slovenia
MARCINIAK FOR FINAL:
+ great form
+ two matches without controversies
+ guarantee of control at pitch
- he had WC, CL and CWC finals - if he will get a only referee in history with everything - what will going with ego Rosetti?
- huge mistake in UCL SF
- Germans
- his treatment by commitee
- lack of logic in his appointments at this tournament
TURPIN FOR FINAL:
+ very good European season
+ appreciation by Rosetti
- France in semi;s
- average tournament
- very poor first performance (if he wasn't Turpin, he should be at home from 3 weeks)
Who will be a ref in final?
Logic and analysis should suggest only Orsato (Orsato was great at WC22, but final due to nationality went to Marciniak).
Zwayer will get Germany's revenge on Taylor and England ,a joke of an appointment .Purely political and not merited
ReplyDeleteIf Marciniak gets the final how you see his treatment this tournament? Kind of a smokescreen? We were told he was berated by Rosetti in front of his colleagues. Even Chefren detected his treatment was kind of weird and hinted a lack of confidence? Out of favour?
ReplyDeleteBut now it seems he is the favourite for the final (ESR is always right so I assume Orsato is in home), so it was all of that planned? Rosetti improvised or did he fooled all of us?
Even more, if Orsato is home, is not a betrayal? How is he going to receive this "treatment" by his compatriot? Chefren you are italian so you should be able to explain more, but in my view this is going to be veeery controversial, maybe a personal vendetta?
I may remember that @Samuel predicted Marckiniak for WC 2022 final from the start and he did the same this tournament and nobody took him serious, so presuming you are polish (I think you are), my doubt if is you are more informed that we believed or you just lucked out, but I believe more the first one!
Chefren you must admit Rosetti is doing very fine from your perspective! His disgraceful selection of referees is translating into a lot of comments and views to this blog, so you should thank him! :)
Rumours about Orsato in home, and meanwhile La Gazzetta dello Sport and DailyMail reports that he will be in the final. (dailymail reports also Taylor in home).
ReplyDeleteHonestly if Orsato is in the home, I can't see a logic:
- missed penalty to Germany could be a reason for rejecting -> not, he get a R16 with Slovenia's Ceferen
- he get a QF (so, we can accept his decision about penalty in PORSLO)
- now, when every sign in the sky can suggest that he will be a main ref on Sunday - rumours about being rejected?
If they want reject Orsato from final - why the did't send him to home after GS when they have a reason?
If they didn't want to give him a final - why Orsato didn't get a sonorous game as farewall (SF or match like Spain-Germany)?
https://www.gazzetta.it/Calcio/Europei/08-07-2024/l-arbitro-orsato-in-pole-per-la-finale-di-euro-2024.shtml
DeleteThe article from La Gazzetta was written yesterday (published in today's edition), so a quite long time has passed.
DeleteIt seems indeed that now Orsato is home as well, according to multiple reports, but I share your doubts about the management, why after a Round of 16 and a Quarterfinal in a row? Definitely strange...
What if Ceferin rejected Orsato for the final, so Rosetti found him a final match in the QFs?
DeleteThat sounds crazy, but it might be the actual explanation given nothing else really makes sense.
Did anyone pay attention to Orsato after the penalties this weekend? Did it appear, at all, as though he knew it was his final match?
Have to say I bet no-one Looked at Orsato after the penalties as we all thought the final was his probably!!
DeleteIf Ceferin rejected Orsato for the final, which could explain a further appointment - but why not appoint to a SF (Esp v Fra). Put Vincic on the Eng v Ned SF (as he was always planned it seems) and then use the German team in some capacity on the final . Surely that appeases everyone and would stop the media madness about Zwayer / Bellingham which is just getting more and more widepsread
I love Mikael analysis but I love more his rants and I think now you should vent off about Rosetti! Shameful behaviour all this tournament! Just let me enjoy and use your british dry humour! :)
ReplyDeleteTaylor won’t officiate a France v Netherlands re-match after this went viral on TikTok and other socials
ReplyDeletehttps://youtu.be/OL8d0MtPuGg
:-)
DeleteMedia has already been extremely harsh to Zwayer and highlighting his match-fixing scandal and incident with Bellingham. Zwayer will be under huge pressure on Wednesday.
ReplyDeleteThis suggests us that committee was rather forced to make this appointment. One can't think about Rosetti making this choice, definitely. When their first worry is about making all happy before, during and after the game. They just had to give something to Germany and they selected this game. In Spain game, Zwayer would have been even more controversial.
DeleteCalvarese on IG just said he thinks after Zwayer appointment, Daniele Orsato has a very little chance for the final. He said it will probably go to Marciniak. Calvarese last week also said he knows NED-TUR was Turpin last match (he said this live on RAI TV)
DeleteAccording to this newsarticle UEFA has considered withdrawing Zwayer following the many Bellingham reports
ReplyDeletehttps://www.vi.nl/nieuws/uefa-heroverwoog-oranje-scheidsrechter-die-verleden-heeft-met-bellingham
Impossibile to believe. Rosetti had all elements, withdrawing the referee would be another scandal of poor management.
DeleteAgree but for me after this Euro not so hard to believe ;)
DeleteEven if they remove him, I think the damage is done. They removed him, everyone will know why :-/
DeleteManuel Grafe on X:
ReplyDeletehttps://x.com/graefe_manuel/status/1810277889276813430
All tweets are interesing by former German referee. To be honest, I'm a fan of refereeing since +/- 10 years, and I didn't hear about Hoyzer case, so I suppose that too many people will know about this history, a terrible PR for Committee.
Completely shocking tweets. No referee should speak publicly in such a way about other referee.
DeleteSo Marciniak will follow exactly the same path as in WC 2022 (MD2 and R16 and straight to the final)!!
ReplyDeleteAnd to be honest - it is enough for grand final? We know, Marciniak is in his peak, he is great ref with personality, but WC final (only 2 matches before the biggest nomination in referee's life and trust by Collina), now only two weak matches (not a top clashes) and he will be a first ref in history with everyting (WC, CL, Euro, CWC?) Not too much? Specially in 1,5 years?
Delete2021: Marciniak out of EURO 2020 (2021), behind almost 20 referees! (And not even controversial, everyone said it was deserved)
ReplyDelete2024: WC, CL and EU (not official yet) final!!
Chefren you must admit it is something out from a movie's plot!!
Amazing!
Im not happy with this appointment. The media is cruel and people on social media are no less. This is resurrecting what Zwayer wants to burry once and for all which is a bad past that shouldn't define him as who he is now. Really unfair appointment for him. Then on top of it what happened with Taylor and the German team makes it even worse. What were they thinking???
ReplyDeleteUnfortunately if Zwayer wants really high profile games this will inevitably be part of it. Maybe he shouldn’t have accepted a bribe
DeleteOliver is right that, at some point, if Zwayer wants high level games, he will need to face the media storm eventually. And they will just have to grit their teeth and take it.
DeleteHowever, what is irresponsible from UEFA is the lack of PR preparation to support Zwayer, because MF is right: if UEFA believes Zwayer is a fair referee, then is unfair to him for this story to define his legacy. A responsible organization would be prepared to counter the prevailing public narrative with their own side of the story on why they trust Zwayer. The fact that this defense hasn’t happened is really unfair on the referee.
I've said this a few times now, these SF appointments (regardless of the politics of them) could backfire spectacularly!
ReplyDeleteVincic - who hasn't officiated since MD2 with Spain again could struggle.
Zwayer - Quite honestly doesn't get this appointment on merit (despite what others have suggested) Who made a really bad decision in 2005 (and will quite honestly never be able to shrug that off) is put in a terrible position in what should be one of the highlights of his career.
One just hopes - despite what we think of these appointments, that both Vincic & Zwayer perform to optimum levels!
If UEFA wanted to give the Germans a gift by appointing a German - clearly Siebert is not thought capable of this match (otherwise the easy option would be to appoint him to the SF).
DeleteJust use the Germans on the final in some capacity (4th/VAR etc would have been perfectly reasonable).
Instead they have put themselves in a right pickle!!
With respect to the news that UEFA would reconsider the appointment of Zwayer we can make easy conclusions. There is a lot of fuss around this appointments. Pros and cons espacially in case with the Bellingham link.
ReplyDeleteTo issue such a statement, or let that "leak" to the media one can create the image that they are seriously listening to the "people". But actually they are not. It's just a form of crowd management.
Following al the different appointments and outcomes discussed here this one is also one for the public and a demonstration of the politics behind the scenes.
But the news can be easily a fake, why you give credit to press and you are sure that it was true what they reported from UEFA? In this case I must defend UEFA, impossible to make judgement based on what a site decides to write, you must be sure before coming to a judgment, that's why I wrote as first comment: "Impossible to believe". Simply, Rosetti had all elements to know that this would have happened, once made the appointment, and he would be a fool now in changing idea after the reaction!
DeleteOffcourse the news can definitly be fake. But as mentioned before all is politics. So internally you share with Zwayer that you have all the trust in him, you just leak a anonymous statement for fan management, in which you state that you are reconsidering his appointment. Both parties happy and Zwayer can do the match thursday.
DeleteMarciniak or Orsato for the final in your opinion?
ReplyDeleteIf Orsato is really out(wich I can not belive), it would not be strange if they appoint the Vincic for the Final also, as WC witnessed Tori Penso.
ReplyDeletehttps://old.reddit.com/r/soccer/
ReplyDeletePossible UEFA re-consideration of Zwayer appointment now top news in football Reddit subreddit...
Not good signal.
German newspaper ZEIT anticipated exactly this scenario in their 2014 piece on Zwayer: https://www.zeit.de/sport/2014-12/felix-zwayer-urteil-dfb-hoyzer-schiedsrichter
Delete"Was wäre zum Beispiel, wenn das DFB-Urteil dem englischen Boulevard in die Hände fallen würde, nachdem Zwayer in einem WM-Halbfinale einen Elfmeter gegen England gegeben haben würde? „Die Situation muss wahnsinnig anstrengend für Felix sein“, sagt einer, der Zwayer zu Hoyzer-Zeiten kannte."
"What would happen if the English yellow press get their hands on the DFB lawsuit after Zwayer had called a penalty against England in a WC semifinal? 'This situation must be extremely exhausting for Felix', says one, who knew Zwayer during Hoyzer times."
Calvarese (former Serie A referee, former Orsato's colleague, actually working for italian TV) on IG just said he thinks after Zwayer appointment, Daniele Orsato has a very little chance for the final. He said it will probably go to Marciniak (that's an opinion). Calvarese last week also said he knows NED-TUR was Turpin last match (he said this live on TV)
ReplyDeleteMine UEFA-kilder forteller at den største favoritten til å dømme årets EM-finale Danielle Orsato er sendt hjem. Trolig pga innblanding fra president Ceferin etter Portugal-Slovenia. Helt sykt 🚑
ReplyDeleteCollina hadde aldri tillatt politisk innblanding ang dommere.
https://x.com/Edvartsen/status/1810361712610066803
Please consider posting in English next time as it saves all of us going to deepl to translate.
DeleteTranslation of the tweet:
My UEFA sources tell me that the biggest favourite to referee this year's European Championship final, Danielle Orsato, has been sent home. Probably due to interference from President Ceferin after Portugal-Slovenia. Absolutely crazy 🚑
Collina would never have allowed political interference in refereeing.
- Svein-Erik Edvartsen: Former Norwegian Referee
Sorry, I forgot translation Deepl or Google translator :D
DeleteAbsolutely no problem, happens to the best of us :)
DeleteHave to say I bet no-one Looked at Orsato after the penalties as we all thought the final was his probably!!
ReplyDeleteIf Ceferin rejected Orsato for the final (as being reported) which could explain a further appointment - but why not appoint to a SF (Esp v Fra). Put Vincic on the Eng v Ned SF (as he was always planned it seems) and then use the German team in some capacity on the final . Surely that appeases everyone and would stop the media madness about Zwayer / Bellingham which is just getting more and more widepsread
Well, I tried to look at him after the last kicked penalty, but referees are rarely shown at the end of a game. Indeed, if this is the story, Orsato should have been already aware at that time, I think. Baut maybe being angry for not getting semifinal and/or final, was a bigger feeling than crying again (he did that in Atalanta - Fiorentina).
DeleteGuys,maybe all of this infos are fake, and maybe somebody said that becouse he want to have less pressure on ORSATO before final. So, we will se what will come in future days.
ReplyDeleteWell, Čeferin interfering and the Čeferin-one-man-show is probably the only explanation for the sh*tshow. And Rosetti is nothing more than his puppet, because I can’t believe that any capable “Referee Officer” by full-mind would make these decisions himself.
ReplyDelete- Zwayer with Bellingham, in a game where he can only do wrong.
- Vinčić straight to the semi-final, indeed after a wrong applied advantage and a shaky SPA-ITA. The fact that mistakes and lack of control/disciplinary didn’t influence the match outcome doesn’t mean he was good (!!!)
- Rumours that Orsato has been appointed to ENG-SWI as last game of his career.. Really?
- Gil Manzano - just 1 GS game, absolutely criminal
- No support for Makkelie after a satisfying performance in a sacrificial game. There have been worse performances in easier games. One Croatian or Hungarian in Čeferin‘s friendzone is probably enough to make the decision. Politics at its finest.
Marciniak’s management has been odd too. If he’s saved for the final - I would be a bit shocked though. Wonderful referee, but didn’t have a quiet an unscratched season. Controversial handball penalty in the PSG (MD5) game. Controversial offside flag in RMA-BAY. And he’s had so many finals already. The FRA-ESP semi-final would be more than fine. Btw, isn’t the UEFA Vice president a Polish?
I am still surprised, they didn't appoint the SF referees the other way around:
ReplyDelete- IMO the (social) media reaction on Zwayer for ESP would not have been as bad as on Zwayer for ENG.
- it would avoid Zwayer in three NED games in a row
- it would avoid Vincic repeating ESP
Agreed. The fact that the assignments were not reversed is a sign that, either, there are some weird politics going on behind the scenes, or Rosetti does not care AT ALL what the media has to say. If it’s the latter, I respect that. But UEFA’s PR team really needs to be doing a better job fighting against the narrative that is prevailing online.
DeleteIf we stick to the facts then isn't the assignment of the final to Marciniak obvious?
ReplyDelete- Orsato refereed 4 matches, Rosetti said max 4 matches + Orsato is not in very good condition anymore. A big risk for the final, when he has already refereed 4 matches including two with overtime
- Marciniak was supposedly the favorite for the ENG-NED match, and he got Zwayer, whose appointment in itself is already quite strange. UEFA certainly knew about it. Why not Marciniak in this case?
- Marciniak would have had the same path as at the World Cup in Qatar (which probably shouldn't be surprising for us if he suddenly got the final?).
- Marciniak would be the only referee in history to referee all UCL, WC, EURO, CWC finals. This is likely if UEFA wants to boast that it had such an refeere. In the end, all the glamor will descend on them. Marciniak is, after all, from Europe.
- A referee with a lot of experience, amazing on-field management and who can write history? Sounds like a fairy tale, but for uefa it doesn't have to be an insult at all (I take into account SF in CL). In my opinion - quite the opposite.
And to add. We all know Rosetti. Wouldn't it be a creme de la creme for him if he appoint Marciniak for final and be the first to let the referee write the history because of HIM? This appointed woludn't even be bad as we all know. It is not like Marciniak didn't deserve that
DeleteYes, but to be honest - it's not a secret that Rosetti didn't like Marciniak - his nominations are clearly pulled by other FIFA finals. I can remind a 2022 when Marciniak was is form, and... Vincić was over Marciniak in race to EL Final, and Turpin in CL Final. SF LC first leg (weakeast from all 4), now controversies with Bayern and being mobbed by committee.
DeleteA plan for 2023? Marciniak also wasn't planned for CL final (he get a second SF Real-City), and his nomination was due to form of Makkelie/Vincić and english team in final.
I think, the treatment of Orsato actually follows the performance principle. It seems supportable, that his EURO performances were not seen as good enough for one of the last three games. But also not so bad, that he needed to be rejected immediately. So R16+QF looks like a reasonable compromise to me, although the R16 game was maybe unneccessary.
ReplyDeleteAnd once we exclude Orsato for the last three games, options are getting slim there, given we also can't use the ENG, FRA, NED and ESP referees. And most referees from other countries probably have not enough experience for a EURO SF - or had a poor CZE-TÜR...
So the remaining options were only Soares Dias, Vincic and Zwayer.
The Portuguese had a great R16, but also showed weaknesses in his GS games (and the ECL final). So IMO, he overall wasn't better than Zwayer at the EURO, but rather similar. And Vincic was worse at the EURO, but came from a CL final and a good CL KO stage. So it should have been a tight call between those three and therefore the outcome is not as absurd as some say in my opinion.
Also the decision for a final referee Marciniak (if that happens) makes sense to me. Before the tournament, Marciniak, Orsato and Turpin should have been the favourites based on their palmares. And between those three, Marciniak simply had the best EURO so far (especially if we look at the first two matches each). So again a supportable choice following the performance principle.
And then keeping him away from the biggest teams makes also sense to have at least one clean option. Plus, as already mentioned, the MD2/R16/final path already worked quite well for him in Qatar.
All that being said, there are still several criticisable appointment choices remaining, of course, foremost Makkelie's treatment.
Also reducing the squad so much before the QF and therefore having to repeat 4th officials for the same teams seems a strange idea.
So, if rumours are true, we have a big scandal for me.
ReplyDelete- Orsato, who probably was planned for final, rejected due to CORRECT penalty (at least supportable) by Ceferin without a referee knowledge
- Germans, who pulled their referee to something big like SF (and Zwayer reunited with Bellingham
- Marciniak, who is probably saved for SF due to rejected Orsato and strenght of Germans is going to Final (the same Marciniak who is mobbed due to behaviour of Germans)
- Vincić, who is going straight due to being pupil of Ceferin
A farewell for Orsato is scandal - ok, if we can accept what Ceferin reject Orsato from big final, a ENG-SUI in very boring game as farewell? Why not Spain-France (a better SF) Scandal is a too little word regarding to outstanding career by Italian and his reputation by Rosetti. - scandal and circus
Marciniak - two month of mobbing and now he is a GOAT of referee with all finals in 1,5 months?
WHAT a circus, what a shame, what a scandals. How can they spit to face a many great referees like Orsato (specially for his farewell).
The question is very clear, was Marciniak already planned for the final or Ceferin meddled and forced Rosetti to reject Orsato in Portugal-Slovenia? An absolue scandal if true! (Which taking into account Cakir's treatment, I belive to be 100% true!!)
ReplyDeleteRosetti must resign, he made a fool of himself! As others said, a puppet!
look at Marciniak's management by the committee and you have your answer
DeleteRosetti should resign, immediately, what a shame.
DeleteWith how big the story in the media has become, how in the world will Zwayer be able to referee this game? One could only imagine a big decision involving Bellingham.
ReplyDeleteI feel bad for Zwayer, he's been through a lot in Germany (of course not reporting the incident and/or taking the money was his mistake,but it also was a long time ago). To reach the Pinnacle of your career only for it to be seriously threatened and probably not enjoyable because of an event in the past would be tough for everyone...
I have faith in him. If referees can go into La Bombonera for Boca - River, or into Dakar for Senegal - Egypt, or into Belgrade for Serbia - Albania and keep a level head to call a fair game, this is nothing by comparison. These are among the best referees in the world, I expect them to be masters at getting their psychology into the right headspace.
DeleteIf Marciniak gets the Finals and all signs are there, this could could go down as one of the biggest decisions when comitee choose to close their eyes on recent past.
ReplyDeleteLet's see:
-if France goes to the Final,then that would mean that he had 2 of their major Finals in 2 years.
They dont remember him very good when ge was in charge in WC22 Final.
So that would be huge controversy.
And abou recent's.
-we have Real vs Bayern incident in recent past.
What,now we are somehow forgetting that?
Since ,Germany is no longer in the tournament, yes,we are forgetting that.
I remember comments and what pundits were saying,they were crucifying him.
And now you want that same ref to handle Finals??
Wow.
-handball vs Newcastle...That also practically eliminated them from CL.
We are also erasing that,that did not happen.
Huge decision and wrong decision that was decided by him.
Not VAR,him.
I can imagine if England get to the Final how they are going to brought that up,just like they are with Zwayer in these moments.
Somehow he will be ref that in one to 2 years has practically done everything:
WC FINAL,CL,FINAL,CWC FINAL and now EURO FINAL.
And some other refs are getting very poor treatment.
Shame on Uefa,nothing other can be said.
Just imagine if UEFA change the appointment from Zwayer to Marciniak for this match and then if Netherland goes through they will give Zwayer the final. I know it is impossible but is it? At this moment nothing surprises me at all.
ReplyDeleteUEFA reconsidered the decision to appoint Zwayer and decided to uphold it
Delete2018: Faghani didn't whistle a final due to sponsporship reasons
ReplyDelete2024: Orsato will be not a ref in a middle in final due to correct penalty, which Ceferin doesn;t like
To be honest, I prefer a 2020 version, when Kuipers was nominee before tournament. At least, everything was clear, and this final was a reward for career.
A case of 2022 (Marciniak), was strange - he was in mega form and has a credit of trust by Collina who nomineed a Pole due to trust and lack of other option - for me Marciniak in 2022 was a #4-6 in European ranking! After this, Pole advanced to TOP3!
Well Orsato was also clear favourite before Euro, just like Kuipers.
DeleteHad similar path and then they decide to give him QF.
Why?
Just bold him for the Final.
That wasn't the problem with Vincic who had 2 group games and will have 1 KO game.
Why wasn't there similar case for Orsato?
Just cause he whistled againsta Slovenia?
If that's the case,then Ceferin and others should be embarassed..
For us who dont know whats happening ... the last news about Orsato and Zwayer (+Marciniak) are just fakenews to get some likes or sth real is happening ?
ReplyDeleteA many reports like this:
Deletehttps://www.corrieredellosport.it/news/calcio/euro-2024/2024/07/08-130062874/orsato_che_beffa_niente_finale_degli_europei
https://www.sportface.it/calcio/euro-2024-sky-orsato-rientrato-in-italia-chiude-la-carriera-senza-arbitrare-la-finale/2611813
DeleteQuite an ugly way to treat a legend like Orsato in this way as he had a solid tournament, is still a top 5 ref today and should have been a lock for the final.
ReplyDeleteJust feels so strange and wrong to award the final to Marciniak after a very poor season for his standards. The Newcastle non pen decision and what happened in RMA-BAY were the two most talked about errors in the whole CL season and those were under his watch.
Good for his career that he's got the 3 big finals in his career in the space of 18 months but I guess that's him done for finals now. Makkelie seems like candidate number 1 for next season's CL final if we're following the treatment Turpin got from Rosetti at Euro 21. At least it's what I hope for his own sake as he deserves it following all the sacrificial appointments he's been given and excelled in in the past few seasons. Rosetti's management this tournament has been farcical though so nothing would shock me anymore.
The Q seems to be why Zwayer? This question arises due to a: his less whiter than white background and b: What Bellingham has said about him.
ReplyDeleteBehavioural wise generally where referees are concerned they double down on criticism.
He is also German.
Like lots of appointments it's political.
All people and refereeing experts in Italy are convinced that Marciniak will get the final because "big name", after Orsato leaving. But I'm absolutely not convinced after the management by committee, and he would get the game of EURO final in Germany after the famous incident in CL with Bayern. They make it so easy, I see things in different way, but yes in case of France - England final 100% no other names there.
ReplyDeleteOk Chefren, you're looking at it through management and the CL incident. And try to look at it a different way...
Delete1. Management by a committee is identical to that in Qatar, a lot of time to prepare, remember that there are trainings, simulations, Marciniak is watched all the time.
2. Matches played so far at Euro. Has he failed at something? Or was everything in place in these two meetings, one GS and one KO?!
3. Incident in SF (CL).
Was it such a "crime" for the commission? OK, Bayern felt wronged, but was it right? After all, they scored this goal after Marciniak's whistle, so in fact we shouldn't talk about it at all. The action is interrupted, end of story. The assistant made the decision to raise the flag, and Marciniak was behind him, and he was offside, and UEFA knows about it, and it strengthens Marciniak even more, despite appearances.
And finally, Chefren, you have to remember that he is in good shape despite everything, that he has judged so many finals and that he simply has "galactic" experience at this level. So why not? :)
I don't want to favor Marciniak in any way, it doesn't matter to me who will be in the final at the end, but IMO if Marciniak was planned for the final, it's fine, Orsato could also have made it to the final, but was he 100% candidate from the beginning, look at his path on this one
DeleteTo be honest, I have nothing against Marciniak, let me be clear, but I think you understand me. It's just about the management by committee that it seems impossible to see him in final. But yes, based on the two games at EURO (almost nothing for him, as the first game was really a friendly one for a so experienced referee), he would deserve the call. Nevertheless, about the management we could write poems. At least we can say that in case of final appointment, looking back at CL semifinal and the managemen by committee, this event had a 0% chance to be predicted...
DeleteIf Cuneyt Cakir still refreeing World Cup 2022, maybe he will get the final not Marciniak as he is a legendary referee which have become FIFA referee since 2006(16 years FIFA license) and records 3 Euro and 3 World Cup, and Marciniak maybe absent from WC 22 and UCL 23 final
ReplyDeleteIf the quality of the ref's performances would have any relevance for Rosetti's decisions, we would have Soares Dias instead of Zwayer now, and depending on the outcome of the HFs and Letexier, or Makkelie for final, in case of FRA - NED Orsato or Oliver. Marciniak would be a bad joke after what happened in CL.
ReplyDeleteBut the bad tragic comedy unfolds in 3D publicly and there is nothing we can do - just upholding the LOTG, discussing the need for simpler handball rules (visible intention? was a chance for a goal destroyed?), giving all informations we have to capable filmmakers with good black humour and praying for Rosetti finding a new job in Ceferin's household.
PS. Any chance Rosetti could step back and Kuipers might replace him?
DeleteI think UEFA is Not living up to its responsibillity.
ReplyDeleteThe pressure on Zwayer is simply too great and Things can only go wrong.
one should therefore Zwayer replace them.
Replacement of Zweyer at this point, should be followed by Rosetti's resignation.......
ReplyDeleteWould that bei regrettable ?
ReplyDeleteIn Dutch media there are also many articles about Hoyzer/Zwayer/Bellingham, which leads to discussions among people that every 50/50 call will be taken in advantage of England to avoid accusations of Bellingham after the game. On the other hand, England will complain about all calls against Bellingham.
ReplyDeleteIn addition, Dortmund’s famous “yellow wall” is expected to turn orange, thanks to UEFA’s ticket allocation. And there is a huge invasion of jumping orange fans in the German streets. Dortmund is close to their border.
The pressure on Zwayer is huge and I have the feeling that he can never do it right in this game. UEFA should have swapped Vincic and Zwayer, but don’t they just love to burn referees? They sent Makkelie to decisive CRO-ITA, where on one hand he met Donnarumma for the first time after a famous incident, and on the other hand, a vedette called Modric who isn’t “used” to losing.
https://sport.tvp.pl/79203855/szymon-marciniak-bedzie-sedziowal-final-euro-2024-twierdzi-vip-z-uefa-drugi-potwierdza-ale-bardziej-ostroznie
ReplyDeleteVery good article, this time in polish media.
The next source confirms that Orsato was rejected from final, because Ceferin has a problem with penalty against Slovenia and more fouls and YC to his country.
Unbelievable. Rosetti should resign immediately, he don't make a appointments by himself (Committee also), he only do Ceferin commands.
If Rosetti want get a final to Orsato, he should keep away Italian from Slovenia matches... At this point maybe its better that Orsato finish his career, in other case we will have a repeat of Cakir treatment.
Only it seems as If one fraudster is cheating on the other and so on.
Deletehttps://sport.tvp.pl/79203855/szymon-marciniak-bedzie-sedziowal-final-euro-2024-twierdzi-vip-z-uefa-drugi-potwierdza-ale-bardziej-ostroznie
ReplyDeleteAccording to this article, all decisions are made by Čeferin. He vetoed Orsato for the final after PORSVN. Rosetti can do nothing and after one of talks with UEFA president his facial expression said it all. It's Čeferin who wants Marciniak for the final but in case of France elimination it could as well be Turpin.
I really don't understand why Rosetti should then continue with zero credibility, as you said, for next season.
DeleteBut the question is: without Rosetti, would the situation be different? Or maybe, all heads of refereeing are obliged to answer to UEFA president?
This article is probably half true half fake. The author has only one goal: to present Marciniak as likeable and only option for the finals.
DeleteCeferin as a publicly known left-wing political supporter wanting a person that was caught on a extreme-right convention? Please.
Marciniak should be lucky to even be part of the Euro after what he did in UCL SF.
I guess that, like in each organization and job, Rosetti must report to his boss and his boss is Ceferin. We can argue if Rosetti has a strong personality or if he is so soft to accept any decision from the top. We can argue if an other Referee committee chairman would be able to make resistance and take decision based only on performance and meritocracy. But each organization is a hierarchical one, so sometime the final decision is on the president's hand. So I guess that the real point is how much is fair, honest and skilled the president. Each organization, farmer, industry, company should be driven by a fair, honest, skilled and not corrupted CEO or president and in most of the case able to delegate. Does Ceferin have such qualities ? If he has decided just because Orsato has assigned a (correct) penalty against his country, the answer is NO. Has Rosetti to resign ? It's matter of money; If a manager like Rosetti is no trusted by his boss and (maybe) by his team, and if his authority is became none, yes he should resign. I think that his salary in the past years was good enough to say stop. But.......
DeleteI dont see Turpin in final, but If I am on Rosseti place, I would appoint Orsato for the final, and said good bye Ceferin,good bye Uefa. There are lot of places that I can work with referees. Now, Marciniak is top candidate, deserved,two very good perfromances. At the end,better then Turpin.
ReplyDeleteCeferin is a dark and corrupt person. I think Rosetti should have more personality and appoint the referees he considers, and if not, resign. What is happening is a shame, I have lost the desire to follow the referees and comment on their performances, it is all random. I feel sorry for Orsato, an excellent referee and very brave and fair. The management of referees in this Euro is horrible.
ReplyDeleteIf Marciniak or even Turpin gets the final, wouldn't that mean that this EURO24 will be the worst in case of referees management by UEFA in XXI century? So many appointment errors, leaks, Ceferin influence, Rosetti referees treatment and so on...
ReplyDeleteIt is already regardless of the final appointment. The management was a d-i-s-a-s-t-e-r. I think a resignation is necessary to be honest.
DeleteLook,all of infos about Orsato should be taken as 50/50. You ll newer now what can happen.
ReplyDeleteBut on the other hand Italian Sky Sport TV says Orsato is already in Italy so he can not be considered for the final now. I think it is game over for him at this point
DeleteIts easy to flight again for Italy to Berlin.
DeleteWith hindsight, it all becomes clear why Irrati was over-used as VAR/AVAR in R16 and QF…
ReplyDeleteYes,but Collina also had boss in Uefa. Does anybody think that he would allowed himself such situation. Absolutely not.
ReplyDelete