Friday, 5 July 2024

UEFA EURO 2024 Match 45: Spain - Germany (discussion)

English referee Antohny Taylor about to officiate Spain - Germany, very big game at EURO 2024. 


Game 45, Quarterfinals
Stuttgart, 5 July 2024 18:00 CET
SPAIN - GERMANY
Referee: Anthony Taylor ENG
Assistant Referee 1: Gary Beswick ENG
Assistant Referee 2: Adam Nunn ENG 
Fourth Official: Ivan Kružliak SVK
Reserve Assistant Referee: Jan Pozor SVK 
Video Assistant Referee: Stuart Attwell ENG
Assistant Video Assistant Referee 1: Bartosz Frankowski POL
Assistant Video Assistant Referee 2: Massimiliano Irrati ITA
UEFA Referee Observer: Roberto Rosetti ITA
UEFA Delegate: Per Svärd SWE

236 comments:

  1. Possible YC, Taylor not interested in giving it.

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    1. Possible? That is a clear YC all day!!! Pedri is now replaced due to the injury inflicted by Kroos.

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    2. For me also clear YC and 1 min later next possible YC for Kroos

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  2. Missed foul + YC for Kroos, bad start for Taylor

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  3. Exact contrary to Oliver in the last game, very much physical play. If Taylor allows that, it will be an interesting match to watch…

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  4. Missed foul by Taylor on Yamal by Kroos. Could easily by a YC for Kroos for persistent infringement given his earlier heavy challenge on Pedri.

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    1. For what it's worth, I don't think the first foul in isolation is a YC. High careless, for sure, but at the end of the day, it's knee-to-knee contact, with Pedri's speed making the challenge look worse than it is. Also no clear SPA.

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  5. Missed 2 YC for Ger. 2 recklesses on Pedri and Yamal

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  6. Very poor start one must say, this is not refereeing a game.

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  7. A joke that Kroos is still without Yellow

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  8. Kroos with two YCs forgiven: reckless tripping on Pedri and reckless/SPA step on foot on Yamal. Nice modern refereeing...

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    Replies
    1. I prefer Kovacs style than this one. Taylor will not have the final this Euro

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  9. Well besides anything else the mobbing guidelines went out of the window so far in this game 😅.

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    Replies
    1. Indeed, I was about to write that, when he was surrounded by many players, he definitely did that!

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  10. Taylor started badly, even the Spaniard's exit from the game is Taylor's fault

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    Replies
    1. Your anti English bias is on clear view ,actually if you had refereed any kind of sport you would know it is difficult to everything right and is very different to the multi angle TV cameras

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    2. There is an expression in Turkey, "Staying French", which means remaining unresponsive to the events, I guess you remained French to the events :)

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  11. You can really argue that Kroos could have got 2 yellow cards for these fouls. I would say that Taylor should have given the first one for sure and the second one as well.

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  12. Very very bad refereeing. Two missed yellows Kroos.

    Its a shame and its loud and clear .... not the best man for this match

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  13. Kroos should have already been sent off in 7 minutes (of course, if the first YC had been given, he might not have committed the second one). No cards for him so far, which is close to unacceptable.

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    1. I agree that he should get YC,
      but no, he won't be sent off, for God sake.

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    2. The first YC was clear and mandatory. Of course he wouldn't have been sent off, the first card was missed. However, my point was that both situations were YC. I would have expected the first one to be given and the second one forgiven, but if you not only fail in the first card but also completely miss the reckless stomp in the second, you cannot manage anything, it is what it is: two mistakes.

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  14. This is the type of referee that can change the result of the game. It cannot happen at this level

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  15. The English referee continues with warning, he can lose the game, this is the problem when a referee with English culture comes to officiate different teams.

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    Replies
    1. This is a problem with any referee unable to adapt his refereeing style to the match - which is unacceptable for any elite

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  16. What a surprise - Taylor just being Taylor, but still refereeing at this level

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  17. Hmm. Taylor is obviously trying to manage this game without cards as long as possible. Not punishing the physical. Vincic style. But when the foul is so blatant and player has to be substituted… Come on. Protect the players.

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  18. Good timing for a YC now.

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  19. Kroos should be out of this match within 10 minutes. It would be not the correct end for his career. Taylor must improve or his chances should also be out. Bad start

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  20. Meler would caution both missed ycs with yc

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    Replies
    1. You can’t know that. Meler has never refereed a high profile
      fixture anywhere close to SPA-GER. He might change his style as well, like most referees do when they are in the middle of this, trying to stay in the background at all costs :/

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    2. Meler would have yc two or three players and then not bothered with worse challenges as he did in the last 16 tie.

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    3. I think you're an enemy of Turks, that's clear.:)

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  21. That is fantastic that the rules is out of order, my Good! You can speak about emotions but....

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  22. So we can say, another referee, take as example Meler, would have booked the player already for the first foul. Then, a sending off was possible. What is the correct officiating, according to UEFA committee? Since they like really much Taylor, I have some doubts.

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    Replies
    1. with the first YC issued, Kross would have not done the second foul

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  23. This thread highlights how referees can't win! Bring out the YCs too early and you risk a Kovacs situation; try and manage the situation and you're not protecting players' safety. I think there's a missed YC for sure for Kroos, but anyone that would have sent him off within ~10 min of a quarter-final needs to be realistic.

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    Replies
    1. At least they are focused on playing football right now. The YC calmed things down, like it should when issued at the right moment.

      However, Taylor should have issued it earlier. Now, it could be a headline in Spanish media if they lose: Pedri injured and not a card at all.

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  24. What on earth am I reading - Missed red card for Kroos? Nonsense. Missed YC maybe for the Pedri foul but wasn’t mandatory

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    1. Thank you! I thought I was going a little mad. In the first 8mins, you had about 3mins of football and two 'decisions'. Not sure what else he could have done other than maybe 1YC! The first tackle was in the first four mins, deep in the opposite half, and included a touch on the ball, very few would punish that early on. The second one was probably a YC, although it would also be true that English officials are often a little gentler on standing on foot offences. I don't think one missed Yellow means it's very bad!

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    2. At least mismanagement and a referee not ready to protect the players. I agree one cannot say that a sending off is missed, but Kroos not having been cautioned at all after 6 minutes, a mobbing guideline completely ignored and a coach believing his players can be fouled without consequences does not make a good start.

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    3. Nobody says missed red card for Kroos, it was simply impossible. What I meant is that two cautionable offences were missed or misinterpreted, and that the player, with the risks he took, should have been sent off had the incidents not been missed. That is not the same as saying that a RC was missed. 2 YC were.

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    4. Refwatch That’s wrong. He managed it fine. If he gave out 4 yellows for dissent everyone would be on here complaining, you can’t just choose a player to caution. Like I said maybe a YC but there are arguments against it. It doesn’t warrant 50 comments in here

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    5. You’re completely free to disagree with me, but no need to tell me I’m wrong.
      And if you’re OK with not following the mobbing guidelines here, good as well. But if not now, when dó you think they should be adopted…
      Just fine if you think Taylor managed well, perfect! But I don’t agree here.

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    6. Sorry, didn’t mean it like that. I disagree, no issues :-)

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  25. YC for Kroos missed...
    But now two YCs for German players very good

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    1. And I can't see comment about good YC in the comments. Too many visitors of this blog are just mistake hounters and card counters.

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    2. Oh wow, a referee that gets correct 50% of the YC to issue. Let’s celebrate…

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    3. You missed the point, mr. observer

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    4. As Chefren already pointed out, the issued cards are inconsistent with the management. We can’t comment only about Correct/Incorrect cards but we must correlate them to the management. And so far, it is real bad

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    5. While I understand your point, I moved to a different location after writing the post. Yes, some correct YC, but also too many (at least 4, 2 for Kroos, 1 for Emre Can and another for Rodri) missed. This is an EURO quarter-final, clearly a bad moment to have a bad day.

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  26. The trend of the game, now, with many fouls and cards, sorry to say, it's also because Taylor tried to start in that way, and players are still thinking they can commit rough fouls.

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    1. And after 2 YCs for GER and 1 for ESP, we will see does it make some effect on players

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    2. Inconsistent management, and we are only at 32. If Spain scores first, it can get very heated

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    3. after 3 YCs the players are more calm ... it was a very bad decision not to give the Yc in the 3 min. for nr. 8 GER

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  27. I'm the first who understands why Taylor has this reputation by committee and he is liked by Rosetti, but today the start of this game for him, to be honest, was the worst possible. And it is not about wanting to count cards or not, Dr Mr, it's about trying to read the game and being consistent. Taylor wanted that the game continued without cards, and he was't able to understand what to do.
    On the other hand, there are top Elite referees who are very clever in that, knowing when using a style and why not, but it seems they are not liked by committe...

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  28. It's a fact that everything is political in Europe, if Meler had managed so badly I'm sure he wouldn't have been able to play for 6 months but if Taylor, Zwayer, Orsato had made these mistakes I'm sure it doesn't matter because nationality is more important than facts and Rosetti really needs to go and now he's the president You don't need another Italian to make it happen

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    1. Ironic you are talking about politics in refereeing ,when Turkey has had the worst refereeing politics of all developed nations.

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    2. I don't even feel the need to answer you, I hope you have a nationality?

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    3. No i was pointing out that you are blaming the politics of EUFA ,there is politics in all aspects of sport and there will be great referees in Turkey ,who have never had the chance on the international level because their face doesn't fit with those in charge.

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    4. You clearly don't know Felix history in uefa before euro. Already passed seasons and seasons without a single match in CL because of mistakes... It's easy now say this because he is on top. Come on.

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  29. The first foul by nr. 8 GER it is a clear YC (not given).
    The second foul (bad call to not give the foul) it is not a YC in my oppinion.
    The others YCs are all correct calls.
    There is also a possible YC for the nr. 23 GER in the 30 min. In my oppinion wrong call!

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  30. By the way, at the Paris 2024, will be used Uefa rule? Or FIFA doesn’t agree this rule.

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  31. Replies
    1. Semi-Spa not 100%, not a modern SPA by Rodri. Warning was fine

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  32. No SPA yellow for ESP16 ?

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  33. How i don't give a YC here, pretty insane miss

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  34. Did Taylor just signal advantage and then still whistled with delay?

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  35. Oh come on, no YC even for ESP24… that is unbelievable refereeing

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  36. And now another missed YC for Cucurella in min 45+1, what a comedy :)

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    1. It was a challenge for the ball (from nr. 24 SPA) and after that an advantage.
      In my oppinion it's the best call to just give the foul without YC.

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  37. missed YC
    6' Kroos v Pedri stamping

    possible YC
    4' Kroos v Pedri borderline reckless+SPA
    12' Williams v Kimmich borderline reckless
    31' Can v Yamal borderline reckless+SPA
    40' Rodri v Musiala borderline SPA
    45+2 Cucurella v Gündogan borderline reckless+SPA

    Hard game for Taylor, nearly impossible to hit the sweet spot in disciplinary measures.

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    Replies
    1. Very good comment. It's true but the problem is when you orientate the disciplinary control solely around the temperature of the game in given moments, rather than having a clear/consistent/(predictable!!) criterion. This kind of refereeing for big games + the players are nervous, where instead of giving the match 'direction' you do this, rather ruins the game. In my eyes this is quite ironic, given the 'Football 2014' project which I spoke about in the past. Taylor refereed (and, arguably, 'ruined') the big Manchester City vs. Arsenal match in the Premier League this season in the same way.

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    2. Thanks for listing them.

      4' is not borderline. Stopping such dynamic action with such a strong contact is simply reckless. Check A16 from last UEFA RAP, it's far less than Kross' challenge and still is reckless for UEFA.

      Other possible YCs were rightly not given, imo. The closest to YC was 45+2'.

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    3. Just remember any referee only has one view of an incident and has to make an instant decision ,no benefit of several camera angles and multiple replays as you see.

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  38. A very poor first half in terms of football. Not the best performance by Taylor that in my opinion so far would get 8.0.

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    1. Clearly you are a person who is sat in an armchair and never refereed any sport as are several others on this forum .if you had actually refereed sport ,you would know things look different from other angles ,players can obstruct your view ,and you don't have the benefit of several angles from different cameras

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    2. What are you talking about? Don't you agree? Then post arguments instead of going ad personam. Ridiculous comment.

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    3. No i am pointing out on here that that there are lots of commentators ,who have no refereeing ,coaching or playing experience and just see a game at face value and do not understand the technical nature of when you are on a pitch.

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  39. Stamp on foot is always yellow!

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  40. Pulling the shorts? No! Euro!

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  41. It was the right moment for a YC for nr. 8 GER (min. 57) ... but Taylor doesent think so!

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  42. Still no yellow card for Kroos is just impossible

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    1. Finally first YC at 66

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    2. After literally 10 fouls! Now missed YC(s) for Kross shows its importance.

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  43. Kroos was clever there, he realised his next foul was a YC no matter what so made it an important one😅

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  44. Missec very clear offside by AR2, possible penalty later for handball, but impossible to intervene.

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    1. Not so clear because of the defender posture, but still offside

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    2. It’s offside but it’s definitely not very clear

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    3. It's clear only on replay (from opposite camera angle) but AR couldn't see the white player (in the offside position) from the red player.

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    4. That's incredible desription! Of course he could, when white was offside. It is visible for sure, that's his job.

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    5. Not so clear to blame the AR

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  45. AR2 with several offside mistakes.

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  46. Offside missed before potential handball

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  47. 73'
    It's interesting why AR1 didn't use his flag for foul.
    Did he missed it or he used his microfone...

    However it looked bad

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  48. Correct foul and YC for GER#18

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  49. Definitely offside, "handball" has not been replayed, so can only guess it wasn't.

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  50. Possible penalty for holding, I think correct by VAR to stay silent, should have been whistled by Taylor, not a very clear one.

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    1. They’re both holding each other, slightly more holding from defender. Penalty would have been supported but definitely play on is correct and expected decision

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    2. No way PK, both players hold together...

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    3. Its a lottery when Attwell is the VAR official ,he should be no where near these championships.

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  51. Another missed foul by Kroos, then missed YC for Spain. What a mess

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    1. Good decisions by Taylor, first low intensity and second good foul but without YC mandatory.

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    2. You have multiple angles and replays ,your not the one on the pitch who has one angle and has to make the decision instantly ,if you had refereed you would know how hard it is.

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  52. And now didn't want to give foul for Spain on 18 meters from the goal, after Kross' foul from behind.

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  53. Good! Another 30 minutes of circus await us

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    1. If you think its a circus may be you should start to learn about football instead

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    2. BijJ circus referred to the refereeing, not the match. It is not difficult to udnerstand

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  54. The no foul call in the 90+1 (nr. 8 of GER) i think its as bad as the no foul, in the 3 min. (again nr. 8 GER)

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  55. Possible penalty for handball but Attwell was very quick in waving on!

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  56. Incredibly difficult decision to make there

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  57. Missed penalty imo, shot on goal away from the body

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  58. Again Atwell in VAR in controversial call.

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    Replies
    1. Oh people would call it controversial whichever way it was given. Not Attwell's fault

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  59. Replies
    1. Hence a bitter Roma fan ,who hates Taylor

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  60. How on earth is not being called for an OFR that’s insane

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  61. and the most difficult deciosion of all ... possible penalty for handball in tje 105 min ... i think Taylor made a wrong gesture (hand close to the body) ... it was not close at all but difficult call also

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  62. Good decision imo! Trying to minimise body surface. I’m sure for many the ‘coherence’ with the Denmark call is hard to understand, but in my book, no offence committed.

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    1. Agreed and as does the ITV referee analyst, plus he was bringing his arm closer to the body

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  63. No way PK, close distance and hand in natural position and without active move to the ball...

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  64. Pénalty non sifflé pour GER
    Mauvais décision detous l'équipe arbitrale

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  65. Not clear whether the possible handball by Spanish player before was reason, but in that case there should be more communication by VAR.
    The argument for supporting referee in that handball is that the player was moving arm to body, after having opened it, but still, the touched ball when arm was still not very close to body. In Italy, of course you can easily guess that, 100% penalty.

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  66. Clearest penalty of the tournament. Terrible for Taylor and Atwell.

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  67. Arm is down straight. Natural position. Never, ever a penalty in England. Always a little unsure in Uefa but it's not a European penalty for me either

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    Replies
    1. Cucurella moves his arm towards his body (-> minimising, not maximising, body surface) and is standing upright, ie. not making a physical block on the ball, certainly not acting like a goalkeeper. Hard to understand for some, but imo a sound decision.

      Delete
    2. Too slow in NedFra, too quick today Attwell :D.

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    3. I saw the arm movement better in a later replay, absolutley the reason. And yes, he can't win :-)

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    4. Cucurella made it look like he tried to get his hand behind the body but conveniently stopped the arm movement when the ball came close. Don't get yourself be fooled by a smart player.
      Also, Taylors body language was clearly different from the reality. He should have been given the opportunity to review his decision.

      Delete
  68. Difficult decision. The arm is open but when the ball touch the hand, the player is moving the arm in direction of is body.

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    Replies
    1. The only reason is indeed that arm is moving to body, but is that enough when you hit the ball when arm is still a bit open?
      Too quick, definitely, Attwell, in taking this decision, as it was a black or white one...

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    2. It would be black and white for 90% of the matches he does...

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  69. My God, go to the new dvd from UEFA, clear penalty but now quartersfinal and different rules!

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  70. Offside in build up,but still penalty could have been called and then called for offside.

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  71. Maybe there is offside in the APP that can save him to go to the screen

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  72. For sure, all headlines will involve Taylor in case of Germany loss.

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  73. Italian commentators now making again comments against Taylor, describing him a referee "lost" since the famous game Sevilla - Roma. For sure, this decision in Italy it's impossible to understand...

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    1. It won't surprise you the British (Eng and Scot) commentators have just said he has had a lot to do and has done it very well :-)

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  74. It was OFFSIDE prior that handball! AR2 again missed. Awful performance from him, he missed everything.

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    Replies
    1. you have to remember there is semi automated offside decisions from the VAR official ,who can intervene where necessary .you are only seeing one angle that might not be giving a true picture

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  75. Anyone who thinks this is a pen seriously needs to review their handball considerations. Hand is very close to the body when the actual contact happens, and the hand is moving back towards the body. Excellent decision by Taylor.

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    Replies
    1. Absolutely! If you think 0,5m is "very close" then I totally agree with you. Yes, he tried to pull the arm in, unfortunately, he didn't manage to do that in time.

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    2. Fully agree. No penalty. This is not even close to be debatable. Clear situation with no other dicision to be supported. Clear Var Intervention if penalty given.

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  76. Headlines to come this time. Is this is the only criteria we have one less final candidate

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  77. Maybe missed 2nd YC for Wurtz. Very controversial refereeing.

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    Replies
    1. You cannot be serious. Absolutely nothing there

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    2. For the Spain number 4 incident? You've got to be joking...

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    3. Nothing happened mate

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    4. I said MAYBE so chill out guys! No words from you about offside, but you jumped on me for that incident. Spain went through, so I forgive you :)

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  78. Both sides need to take responsibility for some of the poor blatant attempts at cheating ,which is making Taylor's job a lot harder

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  79. Worst scenario for Taylor.

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  80. I am wondering why Taylor is always so “unlucky” when it comes to top matches. Many incidents, never clear and obvious. The pattern is always the same: the higher the level, the more incidents he deals with. Cannot be just random

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    Replies
    1. Well, there's only one common denominator in it all. ; )

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    2. You clearly are a bitter Roma fan ,who has never referees ,any sport in your life .The facts are cheating players make the game harder for all referees

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  81. And now let’s waiting for the German newspapers tomorrow…

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  82. Sorry to say, there will be very tough, terrible days and weeks for Taylor.

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  83. Absolutely correct second YC and red card to Spain.

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  84. Bad performance by Taylor ! I don't like his style

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  85. Carvajal intentional grab to the face requires a straight RC imo

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  86. Lets say, decent performance by Taylor. As it mentioned, always unlucky that he always have some incindets that are important to the game. Only to said-for what he is sent, he did. Only thing that is cleared now, we have candidate less for final, of course i still se cleared road for Orsato.

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  87. Anyone has a video replay of the handball incident?

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  88. Decent?

    Oh my gosh.

    He can go home.
    Huge mistakes and bad managing of the game.

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  89. A really bad refreeing peformance.

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  90. Not to appoint Makkelie for this match is the biggest mistake. The ones responsible for that should resign.

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  91. Superb job, as close as to flawless, by Taylor/Attwell team. The pair definitely number one candidate for the Final-- unless England advances that far.

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  92. basically before Carvajal red card, time was empty. Poor Taylor.

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  93. Sorry, Taylor shouldn't have refereed the game. Rosetti please resign!

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  94. Can't believe some of these comments, just seems like people have vendettas against certain referees. Good performance from Taylor but looking at these comments you'd think he'd had an Ovrebo performance. Kroos probably should have been booked earlier, but all PAI were solved correctly, never ever a handball in 105', arm close to body and retracting it. The discourse on this forum during these Euros has been bordering on ridiculous at times

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    Replies
    1. 100%. There is scope for objective, measured disagreement but calling this a horrible performance is insane.

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  95. Some of the vitriol and hyperbole in this blog is insane. I hope people making inflammatory comments are not observers themselves, we really are our own worst critics sometimes.

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  96. Stylistically, Taylor fell into the same trap as Webb in 2010 and Lahoz in ‘22 in trying to let the players figure it out. They never took the foot off the accelerator and ease back into a space where ‘we can foul but it’s below the line’. Taylor then had to react and by then, he had no option but to do with cards and it was not effective. One could ask if a control card would have helped it earlier but he was gonna have to pick something soft.

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  97. As I am German I will refrain from commenting on Taylor's performance. The only thing that could save Taylor now would be if it was offside before the possible handball and UEFA announces it quickly. Otherwise, the next few days and weeks are going to be very rough for Taylor, no matter what you think of the decision.

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  98. In my opinion a bad performance from Taylor today. 16 yellow cards, 1 red card. They played until 120+7 when the extra time was 3 mins. He can go home now, but Rosetti will defend him as always.

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  99. Anthony Taylor, the UEFA version (equivalent) of CONCACAF's Mark Geiger (USA).
    *2015 CONCACAF Gold Cup - Mexico v Panama
    *2018 FIFA World Cup - Colombia v England
    *2024 UEFA Euro - Germany v Spain

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  100. Is it an accident that all those calling Istvan Kovacs judgment in Turkey vs Czech great, now calling Taylor a terrible ref?!!! I seriously think either people are so bias against a ref OR they have no clue what football means.

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