Saturday 7 July 2018

2018 FIFA World Cup Match 60: Sweden - England (discussion)

Let's discuss here the performance of Björn Kuipers in Sweden - England. Good luck to the officiating team! 
Match #60
Samara, 7 July 2018 16:00 CET
Sweden - England
Referee: Björn Kuipers (NED)
Assistant Referee 1: Sander van Roekel (NED)
Assistant Referee 2: Erwin Zeinstra (NED)
Fourth Official: Antonio Mateu Lahoz (ESP)
Fifth Official: Pau Cebrián Devis (ESP)
VAR: Danny Makkelie (NED)
AVAR1: Bastian Dankert (GER)
AVAR 2: Carlos Astroza (CHI)
AVAR 3: Felix Zwayer (GER)

200 comments:

  1. We have Zwayer again, as AVAR3.

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  2. Good luck to team Kuipers.

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  3. 5' Is that not delaying the resart? opinions please , Kuipers says play on as it ends up back to an English player

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    Replies
    1. Yes it is but he ignored it and skipped a yellow card.

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    2. The restart was not delayed. It simply ended up being "taken" from a different location. :) Wise refereeing.

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  4. Replies
    1. Not at all for me. Arms in natural position for the action being performed (keeping balance), too close to the ball and, most important, backwards. 100% undeliberate.

      Thing is: it would be a fully incorrect penalty if that was done by the defender, and surely Kuipers would have not given it. Why whistle it when it is the attacker?

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    2. Nope, natural position. He couldnt move his hands when he jumped.

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    3. Because you don't want to have all the trouble if this leads to a goal...

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    4. The sensible referee always whistles that handball.
      Not really so worthy of discussion IMO.

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    5. Wise decision. If ball ends up in goal two or three touches later, we have a superb mess on our hands. Call these -- keep it simple.

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  5. Not the most focused start from Kuipers. No deliberate handball, and then missed foul on Henderson.

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  6. Missed foul on Kane a bit earlier. Late stomp strikes again.

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  7. Better than Tour de France if you want to sleep.

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    Replies
    1. CL qf finished yesterday,,this side is EL qf

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    2. All I want to get from this game is whether Kuipers will remain a top candidate for the final.

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    3. Really boring match 😪

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  8. Wrong offside by AR1 in 25'

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  9. AR1 called offside when player was still in his own half... significant mistake.

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    Replies
    1. There were two replays shown and the Swedish player was offside in the 2nd one and was in the other half!

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    2. Berg was in his on half, plus one English defender was also ahead of him in English half

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    3. It was shown on replay as clear onside.

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    4. I don't know what they showed here then 🤔

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    5. That is exactly what FIFA does not want to see: Wrong offside call whistled early destroying a chance for attacking team. Those mistakes cost chances to get the final!

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    6. I don't think it destroyed a chance for attacking team... It was around the centre line and once flag went up English defends didn't proceed and it looked like there was a great opportunity!

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    7. Bjorn's AR's once again failing him. Bringing his 2018 World Cup and World Cup career to an end?

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  10. Wrong offside from AR1. Completely ignoring protocol.

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  11. Swedish player was in goal chance when AR1 wrongfully caled offside.

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  12. Maybe kuipers could see it,but he missed also,

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    Replies
    1. Of course not it's impossible,,mean player still in his own half maybe he could see it

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  13. Nobody would have argued if Kuipers would have blown the whistle with that pushing foul of Maguire.

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  14. Serbian accounts beeing so much attentive to Kuipers and his team, commenting on each of the decisions they make as if their comments could help Mazic getingg the final over Kuipers or any of the referees left at the tournament.

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    Replies
    1. We're just discussing like everyone here. Why would we blame Kuipers?

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    2. Stop with generalising.

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    3. I think Collina dont read here for appointment any referee :)

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    4. DrMr is Serbian and always talks fair about Kuipers and other referees! Not fair to generalise!

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    5. Last night there were 6-7 comments BEFORE THE MATCH STARTED, criticizing Collina's choice! Every single foul was mentioned in the commentaries and discussed! No one of us even said anything about clear foul on Henderson missed from Kuipers at the beginning!
      If you think this blog has ANY INFLUENCE on Collina and his decisions, then...

      And as i said prior the match - an very easy going one from Kuipers. Expected clam match two correct teams!

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    6. @Teo
      That's also very true.
      A lot of doubting even befor the match started

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    7. I just wrote what I felt while reading.
      I also didn't like last's night unnecessary comments about Mazic "mistakes".

      Maybe I've got higher tolerance level but I don't think the decisions made in the first half have significant effect on the score board.

      Don't get me wrong please.

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    8. We spoke about the only one mistake, wrong offside decision.

      But yes, minute to minute mistake report looks iritating. For example 'Wrong corner in 30''
      Really? Why is that important?
      No goal directly from that corner, that's the first goal kick/corner decision mistake... then why should we mention that?

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    9. Sve je u redu zemljace ☺

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  15. Three possible mistakes in AR1's incident: first, the most supportable in case of mistake which is offside position or not. Second, if it was in his own half or not. This mistake is quite more significant. The third one was failure to abide by VAR instructions for ARs to wait until the situation is finished. To me, this is the most significant one.

    If it was indeed a mistake, Kuipers' team participation at WC should be over.

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    Replies
    1. About delayed flag for VAR intervention, regarding this aspect one should however say that the incident occurred in the midfield. AR was just unlucky that player looked to have a good chance to score, only a few seconds after... but under this aspect, maybe not big fault.

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    2. The trend on this WC is that those VAR instructions u mention, wait until the situation is finished, are used for situations in or around the penaltyarea, not for situations near the middleline.

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    3. I disagree. Incident occurred in the midfield, but there were only two defenders, one of them facing the opposing half of the field (had to turn) and the attacker was closer to the goal. The situation had enough ingredients to be dangerous, so delayed flag should have happened.

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    4. I see George, however, this argument was discussed very often also here in Italy this season, to make it clear when AR had to delay their calls in order to allow VAR intervention: it was said that for situations in the midfield it is in any case impossible, would be too early. One has just to accept that... however, if AR had waited, reading the action, nobody would have accused him of going against the protocol, that's sure.

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    5. Mistake yes but nothing significant at all as it was in the midfield... The possible dangerous attack happened after some seconds of raising the flag!

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    6. This can be your opinion ofcourse, but the instruction obvious seems to be: only delay the flag in or around the penaltyarea. One can argue about if that works well, on the other hand: you have to draw a line somewhere.

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    7. I agree with George. it was immediately obvious that it is a good chance

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    8. Clear error by AR1 (note that it is in 25' of play, not 24' -- lol). Also note that AR is not in correct position -- possibly leading to error. Player, even if slightly in opposing half, is not ahead of last English defender.

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    9. We will have VAR here next season, so I might get more used to these situations, but for now… that approach just looks wrong to me. Many situations in football, and in fact, many beautiful goals start in the midfield with a bad defending in which the attacker is faster than them and gets to face the goalkeeper alone. Protocol should include all possible situations in which a goal is possible. Only after it is clear that the action has ended should the call be made. Otherwise, VAR only helps in a limited pregoal situations which might even benefit some teams over others (i.e. a team who plays by counter-attacks that start in the midfield will not have the chance to have their situations reviewed when mistakes are made, but teams with positional attack closer to the penalty area will).

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    10. But a line must be drawn somewhere to the instructions... You can't keep your flag down for anything and everything for an eternity... So finding the right balance is important! Btw the Swedish player was slightly in the opposing half so that part is okay but wasn't in an offside position... I think it was close enough for van Roekel to just play on and signal after the attacking ends!

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    11. Indeed. My point is that, if the line is where you say it is, it is IMO wrongly placed, as this situation shows.

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    12. Yes I agree... The line that is placed is very much open to debate!

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  16. I can't understand why UEFA referee got assigned for this game. This is a normal match with 2 well behaved teams. Kuipers will not be able to show how good he is in this type of game.

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    Replies
    1. He has been able to show that for the past 10 years...

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    2. Stupid comment Victor. That's not the point.

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    3. This comment has been removed by the author.

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    4. He can referee what is in front of him... And it's nice to have a calm and neat game as a farewell World Cup match for Kuipers!

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    5. Thanks for the nice comment Niko. Very mature. But then maybe you are just 10 years old.

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    6. This comment has been removed by the author.

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    7. DIEDHIOU would be perfect for this game.

      And I am little older than 10 :)

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  17. Good application by AR2 in this case: delayed flag because it was a big chance to score.

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    1. Yes. On replay it looked like big offside but in reality (full speed) it was hard decision to take.

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    2. Yes, but it was so obvious offside.

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    3. Only when you freeze the picture, Sterling is so fast, defenders are moving up for offside trap.
      Even on the training for ARs, that's not an easy decision.

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    4. For me it was immediately evident, without replay.

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    5. Teo will make an excellent World Cup AR :)

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  18. And now excellent onside by AR2... for sure a very good first half for him.

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  19. Very late offside decision 44' when it was rather obvious -- understandably frustrating for Swedish players.

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    Replies
    1. Much better waiting than calling too early. See above.

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  20. Kuipers sort of displaying a little fatigue

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    1. Actually the game is so slow and hectic that he doesn't need to come out of the background anymore as of yet!

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    2. Yeah I think that's why... The pace of the game is so slow that Kuipers doesn't need to anything more basically!

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    3. Bjorn has never really been know for being an explosive and or dynamic fleet footed referee. Movement wise, he's no Mazic or Ramos.

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  21. Good Kuipers till now, but easy and boring game i must say

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    1. Yeah such a slow paced game 😪

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    2. I expected exactly this kind of game. This match could be given to someone with less experience, and save Kuipers for last matches.

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    3. Couldn't have been saved for last matches with Belgium in QF... He won't be possible now that Belgium is through... So good call actually to give him a 4th game in the QF stage!

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    4. Well, Belgium will ply in only 2 of next 4 matches! Other 2 are available for Kuipers - he is not from the Belgium!

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    5. 8 days of rest is more than enough for Björn... ;-)

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    6. Other semi-final okay you can argue yes! But for the 3rd place match with nothing riding on it you don't really need to "save" Kuipers... Any QF appointment is better than that!

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    7. Why does everyone keep saying Kuipers can't do Belgium? That's like saying a Swiss referee can't do France, Germany, Liechtenstein, Austria, or Italy or that a Russian referee can't officiate any of its 13 neigbouring countries.

      Holland and Belgium are two completely different countries... :)

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    8. But if Belgium lose semifinal, Kuipers could get the final. He is still in race, though.

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    9. @Aldawg I don't really know why but everyone says that a Dutch referee is not possible for Belgium and vice versa!

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    10. @Teo Since that's much uncertainty and depends on what Belgium does, I don't think that he could be "saved" for it after Round of 16!

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  22. 25 min wrong and early offside flag. According to the var protocol this is kind of wasting an Sweden attack If the Swedish striker whoul have shot or headed towards the goal how could the VAR be defended according the situations like these. IMO it was one of the most dreadful mistakes throughout the tournament.

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    1. This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

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    2. If AR leaves flag down and Sweden scores goal, VAR can intervene if "not offside" was an error.

      Once flag is up (incorrectly), VAR hands are tied.

      This leaves me to wonder. How much communication is there between VAR and on-field crew at half-time. Is a situation like this discussed so something similar can be avoided 2nd half? :)

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    3. @Aldawg I can report to you that most of the referees take feedback about general decisions from VAR during half time... For sure van Roekel will have a chat with Astroza about it!

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    4. @Soham
      Ronan Lerouz just wrote his opinion. I didn't understand your answer there, he is entitled to write what he wrote.

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    5. When did I object to him doing that? I was calming him down :D

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  23. @ chefren I have a question for you,,this blog is really great and getting popular,,and I am sure lot of referee reading comments about themselves (including elite referees too) do you contact to any referee ? İf you do,you can make a question-answer section on this blog and people can ask questions to referee from here,is it possible? Maybe uefa don't allow this type communications no idea.. what do you think ?

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    Replies
    1. UEFA and also FIFA won't allow that :(

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    2. This is for sure impossible, something like that must be done through official channels by UEFA and FIFA.

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    3. I thought,thank you for this blog,i follow this blog with pleasure,, especially Soham :)

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    4. I'm so happy to hear that :)

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  24. OT: When Belgium reach the final. Is Kuipers still an option for the final??? Belgium, Flanders, they speak Dutch there.

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    Replies
    1. Technically possible but logically unlikely...if that makes any sense :/

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    2. Why not? Completely different countries. Like saying that French referee can't do 8 different countries including Italy, Germany, and Spain.

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    3. It is far, far different, Aldawg. Believe me.

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    4. If a an Argentinian can ref a Uruguay game why cant a Dutch ref do a Belgian game?? But after this performance i feel Kuipers took himself out of the final. His AR didnt help either.

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    5. Eng-Bel in Final, I see no obstruction for Kuipers. Both neighbouring countries...

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    6. Possible. Like Brych had game for SWISS.

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    7. I'm Dutch (born there). Holland and Belgium are no more similar than US and England.

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    8. Jovan, and we all know how that ended. :)

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    9. @ParTime13 Other than one wrong offside call by AR, what else did Kuipers do wrong in this match that he took himself out of the final?

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    10. So what? Coz of that Kuipers cant get BEL? LMAO, what a joke.

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    11. Holland and Belgium are two very friendly countries. There is no chance for Kuipers to get Belgium in semifinal or final of WC! Also, the opponent would deny such a choice.
      That would be the same as Serbian ref oversee Montenegrins in some very important match. Simply, I don't see it possible.

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    12. It's not the same but it should be avoided, I agree

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    13. Teo, I’m Dutch and I totally agree with you.

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    14. On the other side, the final will between countries from Europe.

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    15. And a Argentinian ref for Uruguay?
      The FIFA is convinced that their refs are objective, right?

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    16. But when there are so many other options available one can choose other deserving names as well!

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  25. Clear yellow not given at minute 60. Reckless/SPA

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    1. Well that was surprising.I was expecting to book SWE player,then I saw nothing was given.

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    2. yes, thats a yellow all day any day.

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  26. Yes it was a YC interesting he did not show it. Thought that the game is under control

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  27. Uff.. too many reckless tackle on SWE players not detected. Last one will be dfk 18m from ENG goal...

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    1. He is over confident his handling of England goalie confrontation was very risky

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    2. If the apparent risk pays off, as is the case here, it's only praise for the referee!

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  28. Replies
    1. Teo you were right, you predicted easy match.
      Bravo.

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  29. 83' Missed YC for Augustinsson. I'm sorry, lenient is ok, but we can't stop punishing such fouls completely...

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    1. Bigger mistake was few mins earlier. Yc to Young and free kick in good position for SWE missed.

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    2. Can't understand this YC counting...really

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    3. One of the reason Irmatov is out, beside bad management, is missing numerous YC to give, particularly in Argentina-Croatia.

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  30. Maybe 1-2 missed bookings,but otherwise game was played really fair and players behaved like they should.

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    Replies
    1. He doesn’t ”miss”. He deliberately doesn’t give cards.

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    2. Yep,you're right.

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  31. 2-3 tackles wiith studs like that. No cards given.

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  32. Really Bjorn? You choose to punish that "clean" tackle with the first caution of the entire match? Late studs to the top of the foot stomps/challenges don't merit it, but this one does? Great line! Lol :D

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    1. It was SPA and also he kicked the ball away.

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    2. The card was for displacing the ball, IMO.

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    3. I think the card was for the words exchanged?

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    4. It's clearer now... Card came for kicking the ball away!

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  33. 89': phantom foul whistled by Kuipers. In my opinion, too soft.

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    Replies
    1. I like his decision, that's something footballers call secret foul.
      Slight push before jump, in the crucial momment, when body is out of balance.

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    2. I like his decision, that's something footballers call secret foul.
      Slight push before jump, in the crucial momment, when body is out of balance.

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    3. Soft but not incorrect!

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  34. First YC harsh compared to other challenges. And why was Guidetti carded? Dissent? Player altercation?

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  35. After 40+ matches and familiar FIFA instructions, we are still counting every missed YC here on the blog?

    Come on, I know all your comments are based on LotG and really respect that but there is no point.

    What, ref will go home because of 3 missed YC? Never.
    It should be more drastic, as Irmatov's case, for example.

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    Replies
    1. You are right, but still as "LotG fan", I'm here to writing that :)

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    2. Me too, but we have 3-4 posts about every single missed card.

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    3. Chefren you are much less LOTG fan than many... Sheriff is the unhappiest with so many missed YCs in the tournament!

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    4. So, we have a limit for that? Plus, I guess some of us write at the same time.

      Plus, for me there is a difference between matches without a YC because there simply are no incidents requiring them (CRO - DEN comes to mind) and such that aren't given for whatever reasons.

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    5. Are you acknowledging the type of referee and writer that I am? Or are you trying to take a "cheap shot"?

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    6. There is no limit, you are free to write whatever you want. But I don't understand what is a point?

      You are making report?

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    7. It should be nice to read the reason for missed YC.

      For example, what is point of comment: 75' missed YC ?

      No explanation, so what is a point?

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  36. Good Kuipers performance. Without doubts, he and Cakir are the best referees of this tournment. Both are completes: Security, discipliner, calm and management the match

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  37. Regardless of whether this was his last performance in a big international competition: what a great referee. I know that some of you here like to note every mistake, as if we are watching accountancy instead of football, but let us also take the space to give Kuipers the praise he deserves. He is one great referee and he (already) can look back on a great career.

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    1. Bjorn is synonyme for referee, one of the greatest, for sure!

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    2. In top 5 of all time, giving his palmares, no doubt about that!

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    3. For me it's not just about palmaries. He has everything that referee should have: Good looking, fit, natural authority, body language, positioning, anticipation... etc etc

      I enjoyed every signle match Dutchman handled!

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    4. Most likely he will continue in UCL and UEL for another season or two as he said in an interview before the WC!

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    5. 👍 Great!
      Are you sure?
      Do the "rules" allow him to be an international referee till he is 47?

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  38. 94min. YC Larsson correct but he shows it when Larsson walks away. So the player does not notice it.

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  39. Only little mistakes in a game where Kuipers never was in serious trouble. Sovereign. Still the Sir on the green.

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  40. Very average performance in one veeery easy match.

    If last night's match was normal, as some (to be more precise - one) of bloggers wrote, how can we call this one? And we have only 3 options: normal, challenging and very challenging.

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    1. This is a normal match and we have an expected level performance... 8.4

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    2. Missed several mandatory YCs - 8.2 the most he can get.
      Incredible to put at the same level Mazic's performance from last night and this one from Kuipers - Mazic had much tougher game in all possible aspects.

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    3. Why do you drag Mazic everywhere in every discussion? Are you his lawyer or just patriotic feelings for countryman? Mazic and Serbia everywhere pooh!

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    4. Also what is a "mandatory missed YC" for you isn't that to FIFA or UEFA... Remember you giving lots of lectures during Bayern v Real in UCL that many YCs were missed and blah blah and the very next assignment Kuipers got was EL final... So we can see how your so-called "mandatory missed YCs" were/are evaluated by Collina lol ;)

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    5. IMO
      UCL referee report: 8.2-8.3 (disciplinary) in
      normal match
      WC referee report: 8.4-8.5 in normal match

      If you compare this match to Belgium-Brasil, last night match is challenging and referee mark should be:

      UCL referee report: 8.4
      WC referee report: 8.5-8.6

      Just to add, Kuipers would never miss/skio some cards on UCL

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    6. I was just comparing your statements about last two matches.
      For you, both were NORMAL, and both were for 8,4 mark. I find this strange. Very strange.

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    7. If we even need to compare these two matches... and I think we don't

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  41. Boring game. They waisted 4th game for Kuipers for this one. Totally wrong assignment.

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    Replies
    1. I don't think so! It's an okay assignment for him to end his career at the highest level!

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    2. If Kuipers is not planned for the final, I would prefer to see his in the SF and not in this game.
      Anyhow good luck to him, one of the best referees in the world.

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    3. It's okay, everything can't be perfect :)

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  42. The final whistle of this match ends Kuipers' career at the highest level competitions involving international teams... He ends with 7 World Cup matches and good performances in all of them much appreciation for that... A long career ends today at the international level and I congratulate him on an illustrative career which he can fondly look back on later in his life... All good things come to an end and now it is finally the time to pass on the baton to Danny Makkelie for Euro 2020... Farewell Björn!

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    1. So you are sure that he wont be appointed again?

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    2. I would like to see him as a head of the referee committee after he ends his career. Always calm and dedicated.

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    3. Yes I think he won't be appointed again... Belgium reaching SFs should mean him going home as many have claimed elsewhere! I'm not expecting him in another match!

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  43. If Belgium gets to the final - Kuipers out?
    If Croatia gets to the final - Mazic out?
    Then we have 3 referees lefs - Pitana, Faghani, Cakir? Maybe Ricci if he does well tonight?

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    1. You forget Rocchi and Skomina.

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    2. I think Pitana or Faghani will be the referee for the Final!

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    3. I wont exclude Ricci! He was very good so far. Even the final is not far from him.

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    4. Pitana has 4 games.
      Cakir will get SF.
      Faghani... possible.
      Ricci is not that good IMO.
      DIEDHIOU for 3rd place.

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  44. Overall, not the most challenging match, but Kuipers was as always wonderful to watch. Truly one of the best referees and that's over years. There were a few mistakes, but I'd go with solid performance/expected level.

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  45. Mazic is out in any case.

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    1. Why is he out? Tell me one reason.

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    2. Because his performances have not been so wonderfull.
      We’ll see, this is simply my opinion.

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  46. Good job but not a very impressive one. I also think that this will be his final game at the WC

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    Replies
    1. That would be because of Belgium though... Always some national team ends his World Cup :(

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  47. It was an easy game because both teams knew him, trusted him and got on and played. Couple of times I felt he could have gone to his pocket but he chose to manage. Worked for him.

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