Sunday, 24 June 2018

2018 FIFA World Cup Match 30: England - Panama (discussion)

Let's discuss here the performance of  Gehad Grisha in England - Panama. Good luck to the officiating team! 
Match #30
Nizhny Novgorod, 24 June 2018 14:00 CET
England - Panama
Referee: Gehad Grisha (EGY)
Assistant Referee 1: Redouane Achik (MAR)
Assistant Referee 2: Waleed Ahmed (SUD)
Fourth Official:Norbert Hauata (TAH)
Fifth Official: Bertrand Brial (NCL)
VAR: Danny Makkelie (NED)
AVAR1: Pawel Gil (POL)
AVAR 2: Sander van Roekel (NED)
AVAR 3: Mark Geiger (USA)

166 comments:

  1. I hope Daany Makkelie will do great job, as he did so far. As a matter a fact, he is the best referee among other VAR refs, so it is expected to do the best job. I hope I won't eat my tongue after this match :-)

    ReplyDelete
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  2. Very interesting that Mark Geiger has as many VAR/AVAR appointments (including the one as a main referee) so far than the "mere" VARs/AVARs - to be specific: Seven. One could also put him on both lists, the one with the main referees and the other one with the VARs/AVARs given the number of appointments in both functions. On the other hand, some top referees like Dr. Felix Brych just got a single appointment as a main referee so far but no ones as VARs/AVARs although he could have perfectly supported Felix Zwayer/Bastian Dankert.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Interesting remarks. Given that Brych has already a great experience with VAR in his country, what could be the reason of his absence behind the monitors? Are we allowed to think that maybe he doesn't like too much that role?
      I had already noticed something like that, with Rocchi appointed at least once as AVAR3, while Kuipers never. Kuipers comes from a "VAR country", as well, but like Brych he was never appointed there.

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    2. IMO 'big names' won't be appointed as VAR

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    3. So, Rocchi not a big name there? :)

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  3. Wooow what an elbow in the face of England player! No VAR??? I should erase my first post and eat my tongue.

    ReplyDelete
  4. Referee designations FWC 2018 Match 37: #DEN🆚#FRA⁠ ⁠⁠(26 June):

    Referee: Sandro RICCI (BRA)
    ASR 1: Emer. DE CARVALHO (BRA)
    ASR 2: Marcelo VAN GASSE (BRA)
    4th Off. Gianluca ROCCHI (ITA)
    Res.Ass Mauro TONOLINI (ITA)

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Referee designations FWC 2018 Match 38: #AUS⁠🆚#PER⁠ ⁠⁠ (26 June):

      Referee: Sergey KARASEV (RUS)
      ASR 1: Anton AVERIANOV (RUS)
      ASR 2: Tikhon KALUGIN (RUS)
      4th Off. Ryuji SATO (JPN)
      Res.Ass Toru SAGARA (JPN)

      Delete
  5. Sorry but missed penalty in the 3rd minute. So clear elbow in the face in reckless way....

    ReplyDelete
  6. What an awful start. 2.min.: Clear elbow against head of Lingard. For me YC Gomez/PAN and PK. Nothing from VAR. Difficult to see for Grisha. What do you think, folks?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. The VAR occurred to be the most problematic thing of this WC, especially when we talk about potential penalties. Refs make mistakes, they can't see everything and that is normal. But, 4 refs are sitting in front of 10 TVs, they have evry possible angle to see the incident, they have enough time, and THEY DO NOTHING! How can you do nothing when you have knock out right in the face, when you have double holding, when you have blatant pushing or tripping... That is just incredible. The less thing you should do is to invite the ref to re-watch it. It was clear and obvious penalty.

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    2. There were two knocks to head (one by each player). Referee decided English player committed first foul (gave free kick going out). Not a clear and obvious error.

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  7. 8': Grisha in a big trouble with corner kick management there, he almost renounced to warn players - allowing them to do what they wanted. Then ENG scored. Not nice to be watched....

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    Replies
    1. At same time, holding clearly did not end up being effective. ENG player was free to go where he wanted and scored easy goal.

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  8. So far, 3 strong verbal warnings. None of them really seemed to be received as they should. Not the best start.

    And actually, I hope he will follow up with a YC soon. He has not much authority yet. See the warning before the 1-0. He stepped away and holding started again.

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  9. One of the fastest YC's this tournament, but well done. Glad to see he indeed built up towards a YC.

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  10. I have the perception of a referee who can't communicate in a proper manner with players, being in trouble.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I agree. Struggles to settle his authority.

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  11. Good: YC Cooper after heavy foul in midfield. Attack on foot from behind.

    ReplyDelete
  12. Karasev for Australia - Peru, so no reserve planned among UEFA officials. Sidiropoulos was wrong, but I think that the same committee didn't plan that before the tournament... game is important only for Australia.

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    1. Referee designations FWC 2018 Match 39: #NGA⁠🆚#ARG ⁠⁠(26 June):

      Referee: Cuneyt CAKIR (TUR)
      ASR 1: Bahattin DURAN (TUR)
      ASR 2: Tarik ONGUN (TUR)
      4th Off. Bjorn KUIPERS (NED)
      Res.Ass Sander VAN ROEKEL (NED)

      Delete
    2. Expected appointment for Cakir. It was 1/1 for me. Strong crew with Kuipers as 4th official.
      Glad to see Karasev in one of the games. not that low profile match as maybe expected.

      Delete
  13. Referee designations FWC 2018 Match 39: #NGA⁠🆚#ARG ⁠⁠(26 June):

    Referee: Cuneyt CAKIR (TUR)
    ASR 1: Bahattin DURAN (TUR)
    ASR 2: Tarik ONGUN (TUR)
    4th Off. Bjorn KUIPERS (NED)
    Res.Ass Sander VAN ROEKEL (NED)

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Soham, both of us were wrong. At least you'll see Kuipers 😉

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    2. I was correct in predicting Cakir for this match though :D

      Sampaoli fighting with Kuipers will be interesting :D

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    3. Are you sure Sampaoli will stil be a Argentina's coach??

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    4. Let's hope so... Kuipers - Neymar encounter was great so hopefully Kuipers - Sampaoli also will be the same... The baldy had a good go at Norbert Hauata in the last game!

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    5. We'll see 😉. BTW congrats for the accurate appointment of Çakir 👍!

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  14. Faghani and Pitana still out from a second assignment.
    Faghani seems to be quite sure for SRB - BRA now.
    Pitana very likely will officiate in group H.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Yes, the game without the CONMEBOL team (Colombia).

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    2. Why not MEX-SWE for Pitana? It's a very important match.

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  15. Referee designations FWC 2018 Match 40: #ISL🆚#CRO (26 June):

    Referee: Antonio MATEU (ESP)
    ASR 1: Pau CEBRIAN DEVIS (ESP)
    ASR 2: Roberto DIAZ PEREZ (ESP)
    4th Off. John PITTI (PAN)
    Res.Ass Gabriel VICTORIA (PAN)

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    Replies
    1. I can now expect Skomina in Belgium v England... But what about Brych and Mazic?? One of them maybe in Senegal v Colombia but I think other one will directly get a R16 clash!

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    2. No room for a second game in group stage, for some big names indeed.

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    3. Skomina or Turpin could get KOR-GER, I think. No need for confed neutrality with South Korea already out.
      But surely possible to see someone directly in R16

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  16. A bit soft PK-call. They check that now...but seemed correct.
    Yes PK. I support it completely.

    ReplyDelete
  17. Hm this PK is faaaar less PK than one in 3rd minute.
    BTW great onside from AR2.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Compare this with the ones Marciniak and Brych didn't whistle!

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    2. No discussion about that. Comparing to those two incidents - this was nothing.

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    3. Exactly... So where is the consistency? FIFA needs to answer!

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  18. Very soft penalty call, but supportable. Correct by VAR to confirm it.

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    1. One thing I can't explain: how can this be supportable (OK it is, soft but can be whistled), and also is supportable not to give PK for fouls on Mitrovic, Berg...

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    2. Those were clear penalties missed, but this one is a marginal one either call by referee is acceptable here!

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    3. Quite similar to Oliver's Real penalty IMO.

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  19. Christ,what a delay to take penalty...

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  20. Also,if we are being strict,there were players in the box when Kane took the penalty.

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  21. Loftus-Cheek YC. Much work for Grisha but this YC a very soft one. In my view too much. Free kick enough. He is struggling for match-control.

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  22. too soft YC, if you have this criteria for foul you will show 10 YC every match !!

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  23. Terrible management before the PK is taken. I’m sorry, if you can’t stop these little games with personality, you have to get out a card or two. The Panama players are constantly testing their limits with Grisha and letting them go to far atm

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    Replies
    1. They feel he has no clear line and is fighting with himself, being extremely nervous... in Africacup I saw him beginning same way and then threw around with coloured cards completely destroying everything. I hope he does not repeat that today. Cause in some other games he really acted much better!

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  24. Wow!!! I predicted Karasev, Mateu Lahoz and Karasev right... Yepp🍡

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    Replies
    1. How many Karasev you predicted? :D

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    2. No you write Karasev, Mateu Lahoz and Karasev so I asked :D

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    3. Sorry. Cakir, karasev and Mateu-Lahoz.

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    4. Please get them out of the box. 15 minutes to be added on to the first half.

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  25. OT : I think Nestor Pitana is now candidate number 1 for the Mexico v Sweden match!

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    Replies
    1. Or GER- SKO (I would be happy after all those unsanctioned little fouls of SKO before)
      Or JPN-POL. But MEX most likely now. I expected him earlier for IRN-POR.

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    2. Argentina & Mexico both Lat-Am countries.. and after Switzerland-Serbia (Brych Germany)?? Not so sure.

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    3. In Confed Cup semi-final Pitana whistled Germany v Mexico so it is possible... I think Mexico v Sweden needs a very trustworthy name and Pitana will be perfect!

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    4. But different : Conmebol and Concacaf. That's what counts.

      Delete
  26. 4-0 looks to be a regular goal, but well, AR2 positioning... please take a look at replay. He didn't assess at all the positions on the last passes...

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  27. Oh my god. Astonishing triple play on by sudanese assistant. Big wonderful call by a assistant referee ever :)

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    Replies
    1. Yes but if you look at his positioning...

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    2. Maybe he was just following directives to keep the flag down???

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    3. https://streamable.com/qcw3p

      Not a best example of a good positioning.

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    4. It’s not wonderful at all. His positioning is unacceptable and he thought it was offside but didn’t raise the flag because of VAR directives. He got very lucky.

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  28. Clear penalty,but where is YC?

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    Replies
    1. Dished out after ages!

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    2. Serbia would appreciate this call in the last game. It is painful to watch different referee's criteria on this tournament.

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    3. But it was not YC for foul,it was for protests.

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  29. Shocking actions by Panama players... having said that, I still think Grisha is experiencing many troubles in this game.

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  30. How naive. 2 fouls in the box same time. But locky Panama: Only one PK!

    ReplyDelete
  31. This is not penalty.l, mutual holding.
    Mitrović also holds the defender

    ...

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. It is not 2 on 1 sp it is a penalty ... new interpretations of LOTG.

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    2. Which one of the two fouls in the box happening same time being enough for PK do you mean??? This is now ridicolous.

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    3. This is sarcasm my friend.

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    4. @ Andrasch - I am sorry, that was dark Serbian humor. I would like that every holding specially consistent and with both arms get punished at tgis WC.

      Delete
  32. We see a holding penalised here... Once again if this is a penalty, then the situations of holding in Roldan and Brych's game had to be clear penalties... FIFA themselves are proving as right!

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    Replies
    1. If you compare penalties in different games, you will find always mistakes, of course. The question should be: was that a CLEAR mistake? Or... Was that a supportable choice?
      Without looking at other games. You know how much difficult is refereeing. Having said that, every referee has a different style. I didn't like the one shown by Roldan in his game. Grisha in trouble today, as well.

      Delete
    2. Wilmar Roldan and Felix Brych like your comment 👍 :)

      Delete
    3. I'm not saying Grisha's call is wrong just because Roldan and Brych didn't penalise similar situations in their games... Grisha was absolutely spot on in penalising the holding offence and VAR was absolutely correct to support the call... If anything it proves that Roldan and Brych situations were clear penalties too and VAR should've intervened!

      Delete
    4. Both PK's are more than supportable.

      1. Player charged/challenged through opponent who still had chance at ball.
      2. This hold on Kane was much, much more blatant than all the others we have seen mostly because Kane did NOTHING (not an active "dancer") as in most other situations.

      Delete
  33. Well, the penalty is supportable or just right. Shirt is clearly hold.

    However, the management is really terrible. After he had all pleayers out of the area, a player walked in again, the keeper came out, walked back in a really provocative way...
    Sorry, but in my opinion even with some other good decisions, the mark can not be above 8,0. Long time ago that I saw so less autohority, especially at this level.

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    Replies
    1. I agree, in terms of mark, without crucial mistake, Grisha so far is close to 8.0, even worse than Roldan, one must be honest.

      Delete
    2. Biggest managment problems since for referee so far, completely agree with you.

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    3. Agreed. At least Roldán had some kind of authority. F.e., he did not need to start with 3 very clear 'THIS IS THE LAST TIME' warnings in the first 10 minutes.
      So much 'last warnings' are impossible to sell.

      Delete
    4. Crucial mistake ellbow-check in box and missed PK 2.min. !

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    5. To imagine that initially Grisha was a name preferred more than Diedhiou from CAF... Thank God that FIFA changed their mind after seeing Club World Cup and the CHAN... Grisha shouldn't get another name IMO and he just doesn't give the impression of being World Cup level!

      Delete
  34. no reason to play 2 even halves.

    panama should hop on plane back across the pond before its 10 nil

    ReplyDelete
  35. We also have to say that Panama are not respecting Grisha at all,just like they did not respect Sikazwe in their match against Belgium.
    Looks like dirty fouls and protesting is in their style of play and refs cant stop them even when they book them.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. They play very physical, rough and at times bordering on dirty!

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    2. Right, for this reason, not an easy game despite of a 5-0 at the end of first half. This is very particular under the point of view of refereeing. However, Grisha is not showing the best authority there, if you ask me.

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    3. Welcome to CONCACAF.

      We get to see this from CONCACAF teams all the time. The rest of the world only gets a small taste every so often at the World Cup :)

      Delete
    4. I remember Anders Frisk in such a situation long time ago... he told the captain of a team to call his comrades to assemble in the middle and then made them clear that he will send them off one after the other if they continue that way. It really worked. When a team is used to refs accepting rough play you must try to destroy the normal routine-setting to stop their routine-foulplay.

      Delete
    5. They won't respect anyone, it is their style. You can't give Ycs to all of them in order to start to respect you.
      Grisha is struggling, he doesn't have good management whatsoever. But he has tough match - 2 PKs (both supportable, but 1 missed), 2 close offside situations correctly solved by AR2 (positioning in 2nd situation was amateurish and he was very lucky). So, everything happened, VAR involved 4-5 times already, and in that sense he is doing ok because neither one decision was overruled.

      Delete
    6. @Alex Fletcher

      Well,I dont follow that much CONCACAF region,I watch every 2 years Gold Cup and we saw all these teams in Copa America 2016 so there is my view.
      From CONCACAF region,Panama is team that plays dirtiest,no matter if they are winning 3-0,or losing 5-0.Next I would put on that list Honduras and Costa Rica and then Mexico who has best team but they also have that South American mentality and can play rough at times .
      So it is not easy to referee those teams ,you can never know wwhat type of game will they play.

      Delete
    7. My question is this:

      Is what we see on the referee or on the team (Panama)? Would cards solve Panama's lack of respect?

      If YOU were in this situation, would YOU manage?

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    8. That's how Panama play always. Even the best referees in CONCACAF can't get their respect (certainly Geiger can't anymore!)

      Delete
  36. Hey, guys, just want to thank you for valuable insight in the work of referees. I came here searching for informed explanation of Brych actions, and got hooked to this blog. Thanks.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Welcome! Feel free to question whatever you like and argue as long as you respect different opinions!

      Delete
    2. I like your nick, Ateisto :-)

      Delete
  37. For everyone here still on the field in such a situation: That really can work. Give it a try.

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  38. Grisha is pure entertainment :D That was some tumble :D

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. A bit ashamed ...😚: I feel entertained too. In a way. But I feel sorry for him, too. Waiting so long for that day and then...

      Delete
    2. Vienna Waltz:

      https://mobile.twitter.com/catnipplegirl/status/1010871934530224128/photo/1

      😁

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    3. The ladies are in red or in white? :-)

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    4. What is this photo about?? I mean in what context?? 🤔

      Delete
  39. In German TV the commentator suggested the ref to adapt his interpretation of LOTG to the way Panama players are use to... hää?
    OMG

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  40. i think the biggest thing i see is lack of consistency from match to match.

    kick ball away, then push player who kicked ball away. nothing happens.

    ridiculous.

    ReplyDelete
  41. 58 min. Missed YC PAN Nr15 Davis for pushing Engl. player away before free kick. In.order to discipline management mandatory.

    ReplyDelete
  42. Replies
    1. It's onside. Foot of the defender is the reason

      Delete
    2. Onside by millimeters, if not exactly level

      Commentator in the Netherlands said something like "he doesn't play the ball on purpose so it can't be offside." LOL

      Delete
    3. Agreed, no offside

      https://streamable.com/6vaif

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    4. Commentators were joking or? They were, right?

      Delete
    5. Unfortunately not. But it happens often that commentators don't know the rules or create their own.

      Delete
  43. This complete team is just a catastrophe. Sorry...

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  44. One referee has to make a stand against such behaviour. PAN 4 cautioned at second penalty and then when set up for kick he re entered penalty area protesting again and pointing to half way suggesting a VAR review. I know it’s not the best image for the referee but this style of badgering and lack of respect has to be adressed.

    ReplyDelete
  45. Btw, the way AR1 followed at the 6-0 was quite strange at first glancy. Anybody who has a vid of that?

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  46. Goal from Panama.
    Finally some happiness for them in this WC.

    ReplyDelete
  47. I really love to see Panama-fans so happy now...

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  48. If the result stays like this, the fair play coefficient will decide in the case of a draw between Belgium and England. Doesn’t make the job of the referee of that match easier

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Belgium leads 3-2 in YCs for now.

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    2. Well, don't forget that it is only for deciding first and second place, nothing that important. Nobody will care too much. It would have been a drama in case of qualification to be decided in such manner!

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    3. I would predict Skomina for Belgium v England!

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    4. Well let's just hope that this situation will lead to an incredibly fair game!

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    5. No need of a so experienced referee there, Soham I don't understand why you think that this ENG - BEL is a very important game...

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    6. The only 2 games where UEFA referees are possible are Belgium v England and Senegal v Colombia... We have Brych, Skomina and Mazic without a 2nd game... It's very difficult to see so many of them stay with 1 Group stage match... So I think Skomina maybe appointed there and he can enter KO stage high on confidence on the back of a good performance... Other options may be Turpin or from other confederations maybe Shukralla or Aguilar!

      Delete
    7. It would be a nice game for Sikazwe or Geiger I suppose.

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    8. How about Geiger for Germany v South Korea??

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    9. First and second place are important because of opponents in KO round.

      Delete
  49. Very possible that both Belgium and England want to finish 2nd to avoid a (theoretically) harder path, tis could be hilarious indeed! Wasting time in order to receive some cards.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Panama trying to score while England players celebrate
      https://streamable.com/89wov

      Delete
  50. 8,1 Grisha today I think.
    The same 'last warning' gesture didn't reach any targets, but he was more proactive than Roldan, in spite of struggling in this match.
    I would be very surprised to see the Egyptian again.

    ReplyDelete
  51. How can somebody screw up in a 6-1 game is beyond me.

    ReplyDelete
  52. https://twitter.com/WorIdCupFC/status/1010884774670602240

    What do you think about this? He should have allowed PAN players to continue attacking since all ENG players were outside pitch

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. No, absolutely correct not to allow the Panama players to restart the game. The LotG require all players, except the player executing the kick-off, to be positioned in their own half of the field of play. If all players of one team are outside the field of play, they’re obviously not in their own half, and consequently the kick-off cannot be taken.
      All media are repeatedly highlighting this fairy-tale and to me it’s a mystery how they gathered this “wisdom”...

      Delete
  53. This comment has been removed by the author.

    ReplyDelete
  54. Hello Everybody,
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  56. Private Lender Bentex Funding Group Ltd.
    Greetings to you by (BFGL).
    We are a France-Paris based investment company known as Bentex Funding Group Ltd working on expanding its portfolio globally and financing projects.

    We would be happy to fund and invest with you in any profitable project if you have any viable project we can finance by making mutual investment with you. If you are interested, kindly contact us on:avitinvestmentauthority2@gmail.com for more details.
    Looking forward hearing from you soonest.
    Yours truly,
    Mrs Rose Larsson.
    (Personal Assistant)
    Bentex Funding Group Ltd(BFGL)
    501 Avenue Montaigne,75008 Paris-France
    Paris-France.Bentex Funding Group Ltd (BFGL)

    ReplyDelete
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  59. Private Lender Bentex Funding Group Ltd. Greetings to you by (BFGL). We are a France-Paris based investment company known as Bentex Funding Group Ltd working on expanding its portfolio globally and financing projects. We would be happy to fund and invest with you in any profitable project if you have any viable project we can finance by making mutual investment with you. If you are interested, kindly contact us on:avitinvestmentauthority2@gmail.com for more details. Looking forward hearing from you soonest. Yours truly, Mrs Rose Larsson. (Personal Assistant) Bentex Funding Group Ltd(BFGL) 509 Rue Jacques Coeur,75008 Paris-France Paris-France.Bentex Funding Group Ltd (BFGL)

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